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View Full Version : Time to stop the bleeding....


Ronnie Raygun
Apr 19th, 2003, 10:31 AM
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/4/16/171608.shtml


DeLay: Replace the IRS With Fair Tax
Wes Vernon, NewsMax.com
Wednesday, April 16, 2003
See previous article in series, Taxpayers Socked as Establishment Celebrates.
WASHINGTON – House Majority Leader Tom DeLay wants to get the IRS off the backs of American taxpayers.

By signing on to the Fair Tax Bill, H.R. 25, the Texan has signaled to his troops that abolishing the IRS once and for all is the best way of dealing with oppressive taxation, a confusing convoluted tax code, and an oppressive bureaucracy that enforces the care and feeding of the federal bureaucracy.

The House leader reinforces his determination to get some relief for overtaxed Americans by backing the Fair Tax movement. This is a tax that would be paid on what you consume.

Here’s what the legislation would do:

1. Individuals would not file. Businesses would need to deal only with sales tax returns.

2. Millions of Americans who hire tax accountants to navigate the 4,000-plus pages of the tax code each year would be spared the expense.

3. No more taxes on wages, savings and investments. That alone would increase productivity and result in significant economic growth.

4. As a consumption tax, the amount you pay in taxes would depend on your lifestyle. The more you spend the more you pay, and vice versa. All taxes would be rebated up to the poverty level.

5. Foreign companies would be forced to deal on even terms with American companies for the first time in 80 years. Under the current code, U.S. exports bear an unfair burden, with no adjustment to account for the tax advantages of imports.

“You’re going to have more honest management,” and less reliance on tax shelters, Fair Tax activist George Gettemuller told NewsMax.com. Management “is going to have to be honest, and they’re going to have to be long-term in their projections. And you’re going to see that our manufacturing will come back home.”

That would be “Europe’s worst nightmare” because, according to Gettemuller, we will be “so damned efficient.” We’ll sell our goods on the market at considerably less than the competing products of high-tax double-digit economies in Europe, “and they’re going to have to up the tax on" their own products.

It would help resolve our problematic balance of payments.

“Our balance of payments stinks,” observed the retired stockbroker, who lives in Florida.

“And what’s going to happen is your stock market will go up. Everybody will feel a lot better. I mean this will make the stock market go and make real value,” in his opinion.

Full employment and an end to Enron or Global Crossing-style scandals are among the other benefits envisioned by supporters of Fair Tax.

This movement is not something that was hatched in Washington. Very seldom is the seat of power the birthplace of ideas that provide the average taxpayer with a level playing field.

The idea comes from the grassroots, with Americans for Fair Taxation (AFT) as the guiding force. This Houston-based organization began primarily as a research group that sought to determine what the American people wanted in a tax system and what Americans believed was the best way to collect revenu.

AFT says extensive focus group studies led to the Fair Tax as its choice as “the most reasonable and viable plan possible.”

While Capitol Hill putters around the edges, arguing over whether President Bush’s tax-cut stimulus plan should be cut in half or merely by one-quarter, these citizens are going right to the core of the problem: The IRS, whose job it is to enforce a convoluted income tax code rooted in envy and class hatred.

The worst thing that can happen to radical Marxists is for a rising tide to “lift all boats,” as Ronald Reagan long advocated. If they can’t foment the class struggle, the hard leftists are out of business. They become the proverbial emperor with no clothes.

The_Rorschach
Apr 19th, 2003, 10:47 AM
"he worst thing that can happen to radical Marxists is for a rising tide to “lift all boats,” as Ronald Reagan long advocated. If they can’t foment the class struggle, the hard leftists are out of business. They become the proverbial emperor with no clothes"

Yo uborn that blind Reonnie or do you work at it?

TGell me somehing. Why is communis,m so bad. Really. Not vague assertations about Lubyanka Square amd slain civislians. Don't care to hear about impossible implimenttation. Give m eyour true feelins on this,

Ronnie Raygun
Apr 19th, 2003, 11:08 AM
Strange.

I just copied it and then pasted it....

For some reason it turned " into “ and ' into ’.

Oh, well. No biggie.

Black to the topic at hane.

sspadowsky
Apr 19th, 2003, 11:09 AM
"The emperor with no clothes" is a metaphor, not a proverb.
________
CHILDREN WELLBUTRIN (http://www.classactionsettlements.org/lawsuit/wellbutrin/)

Ronnie Raygun
Apr 19th, 2003, 11:10 AM
Thanks for the hot tip.

Protoclown
Apr 19th, 2003, 12:11 PM
A lot of articles spew out this (”) shit, Ronnie. I don't know why that is, but it happens. If it's a shorter article you could go in and clean them up, but if it's longer that'd be a bit of a pain in the ass. Not much else you can do.

Ronnie Raygun
Apr 19th, 2003, 12:29 PM
THAT'S HOW I FEEL ABOUT PROTO!

TAKE THAT RORSNATCH!!

FS
Apr 19th, 2003, 03:28 PM
:lol Ror, were you drunk when you replied, or was it a joke?

Vibecrewangel
Apr 19th, 2003, 03:50 PM
Interesting......

I have a question about this so I am asking those who are fans of the plan.

Wouldn't the sales tax plan cause more double and tripple taxing of an item as it is being made? Sort of like the mark up with drug dealers?

Wouldn't a flat income tax be more efficiant?

I agree our current tax system is a wreck and one way or another needs be scrapped and rebuilt. I just don't know enough about the sales tax plan to make a call on it yet.

The_Rorschach
Apr 20th, 2003, 11:30 AM
I think I was drunk. I don't really remember posting this.

Don't worry, won't happen again. I have a note now that says "Computers and 151 don't mix!" even though I put it up for a completely different reason (two hours of cleaning my keyboard), it still applies.

Jeanette X
Apr 20th, 2003, 11:55 AM
Friends don't let friends drink and post.

The_Rorschach
Apr 21st, 2003, 02:43 AM
Yes well, easier said than done. I like to drink, I like the Mock, and I love to mix the two. Generally I lose interest in the board before I get shit-faced though :(

AChimp
Apr 21st, 2003, 09:18 AM
Those &'s followed by numbers are the Unicode numbers for various characters (kinda like ASCII, but bigger). In this case, they're the fancy "tilted" quotation marks.

Some news sites use them because they feel that it makes them look more posh. Unfortunately, they don't translate well when you copy and paste articles (especially into phpBB where everything is just stored as plain text and not parsed for special character codes).

:geek

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 07:07 PM
i don't think he was drunk..he was probably just pissed off...you can't type for shit when you're angry because you're trying to type too fast....happens all the time...should take a look in a chatroom every once in a while...then again, maybe not..you people would probably scare all the people away...

The_Rorschach
Apr 21st, 2003, 08:17 PM
You've found me out Waterwitch.

Its true people. I really am a communist, the last two or three years that I've been here fronting as a Conservative have been a ruse to undermine the opposition by showing them to be Christian conspiracy nuts.

I would have done it, too, if it weren't for those silly kids and their pesky dog!

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 08:39 PM
funny...ha ha...

Protoclown
Apr 21st, 2003, 09:27 PM
Hey Waterwitch. Shut the fuck up.

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 09:29 PM
Hey Protoclown. BITE ME.

Protoclown
Apr 21st, 2003, 09:33 PM
What fucking armpit did you crawl out of anyway? You just came out of nowhere to contribute such wonderful insights as "funny...ha ha..." to the boards.

Oh, whatever did we do before you came along? How empty our discourse must have been, in those dark days...

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 09:40 PM
...and you think you're amusing? actually, i didn't crawl out of an armpit...very nice idea though....instead, i crawled out from my bed last night at about 8pm and decided to go online and go searching..and found here...does that answer your question as to where i came from?

oh, and i don't think you were doing too bad...lacking a bit in sarcasm because you stupid yanks can't pull it off right, but apart from that, you're fine...

Protoclown
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:10 PM
Gee, why don't you show me how to pull of sarcasm properly then. I'm just dying to know. :rolleyes

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:12 PM
you pull it off by not getting so worked up and pissed off...works better that way...and you don't make it so fucking obvious...

Protoclown
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:16 PM
This is your first day on "The Internet", right?

The_Rorschach
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:19 PM
You seem to be under a mistaken impression.

We discuss these topics idly for the most part, I don't think anyone here works up any great amount of emotion over abstract conversation.

As for being obvious, if we weren't, the canucks and eurotrash that frequent this place would need someone to explain things to them. We do it as a kindness.

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:19 PM
as i pointed out on one of my other posts under a different thread, i've been online for about 11 years...so no..it's not...

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:20 PM
thanks ror...it all makes sense now...

Protoclown
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:21 PM
So in eleven years time you still haven't managed to dredge up a fucking clue?

The_Rorschach
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:21 PM
Thats great, so that would mean as soon as you set your eyes on Mosaic, you kissed your life goodbye and never looked back.

Congratulations, you are officially the biggest loser I've ever had the misfotunate of crossing trails with.

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:24 PM
and how long have you been online for, ror? and i'm the biggest...? i should introduce you to a few people, you might find that there's worse out there than me...

and clown, seriously, you're not going to make me look stupid...you're succeeding in making yourself look stupid, but it's just not working for you...give up...

Protoclown
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:32 PM
and clown, seriously, you're not going to make me look stupid...you're succeeding in making yourself look stupid, but it's just not working for you...give up...

Wait a minute, wait a minute. If I'm only making myself look stupid, but then it's not working for me, I'm obviously NOT succeeding in making myself look stupid. So was that your round-about way of telling me I'm smart?

GEE GOLLY, DO I GET A GOLD STAR??? HUH?? HUH??? DO I???

The_Rorschach
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:36 PM
See here, you daffy cunt, I realize you are probably the smartest social misift at whatever high school you go to, but you are really out of your league here.

See, we're all grown ups, for the most part, and so we don't have alot of online anger fits, or emotive conversations, which you seem to think is the only type of expression to be found on the Wired. We actually just kind of enjoy conversation for its own sake. Aside from snide, intellectually vacant comments on the only issue you seem to know anything about, and scant knowledge at that, you have absolutely nothing to offer. You aren;t the first Wiccan we've met, nor are you so individualistic that everything you've posted here thus far is in any way new, unique or novel. Your teen angst bullshit is better suited for scratching "fuck the US" on a park bench than posting here.

waterwitch
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:42 PM
okay..we'll get a few things cleared up...

i don't go to highschool...i'm in uni..and i saw a lovely little thread before about the average age of people on here being about 15-16...so how does that make you all adults?

i'm not a cunt...never have been, never will be...i'm not nasty (most of the time) and i try not to be abusive...i point out that i'm not Wiccan, just part wiccan, and my religion has nothing whatever to do with why i post on here...i'm not "angsty" and i can think of much better things that scratching "fuck the US" on a park bench...take, reading a book for example...

i'm not unique...duh...but i'm not this cute little stereotype either...

so don't treat me like an idiot or a moron...i'm neither...

The_Rorschach
Apr 21st, 2003, 10:51 PM
You're not a moron or an idiot. Its quite clear you are both.

See, aside from your immaturity, limited intellect, overly-inflated ego, and unweened arrogance, your ability to pull baseless assumptions from your ass is yet another in a laundry list of traits which will only further alienate you from the human race. Hopefully, such shunning treatment will result in an early suicide, but really, thats just a best case scenerio. That thread you think you might have read, was made by Proto addressing the appearance of recent arrivals, like you, who actually are about 15-16. Few, if any of them, post in this forum more than once.

Now, to address the rest of your tepid responce about not being Wiccan.

"i don't know if you'd call it Wiccan, i don't even know if it's all Paganism"

I call it Wiccan because really, thats just about the only Do-It-Yourself cut n paste religion I've heard of, and besides, you've made certain admissions towards that end anyway. If you are going to waste our time by posting, at least show some spine and stand up for your beliefs, however flawed.

Vibecrewangel
Apr 21st, 2003, 11:32 PM
Copy and paste from my post in the Atheism thread for Ror.
Not that you care about Wicca in particular, but I get the feeling you at least like to be factual in what you say.
Sadly, the name Wicca has become a catch all for for most neo-pagans. Shows how little most of them know about what they claim is their religion. Talk about people who should ahve questioned things a bit more.


Real Wicca is actually a true, albiet young, religion. Gardner based it on many of the old European traditions. It is not an old tradition in and of itself.

Real Wicca is structured and has a set of guidlines/rules that must be adhered to. Just like all other religions. (Traditions don't have structure or a firm set of rules)

What most people call Wicca is actually nothing more than neo-paganism. People picking and choosing what they want from both older and newer traditions and religions. Those who practice real Wicca abhor that the name is attached to things that have nothing to do with it. Even that whole solitary practicioner thing is a great big load of poop.

Too many new age publishers (again I am forced to bash Llewellyn as they are the worst offender) tried to make things pretty and shiny and fluffy to make a buck of people who want to rebel but don't want to go to hell. Unforunately much of what the older traditions are really about has been glossed over and most of the neo-pagans don't bother to get past what they learned at the local new age bookstore or crystal shop.