Universal Health Care

[Command Prompt]

I really can't understand the conservatives on this one. At all.

Any right wingers on this board care to share their views?

[Tadao]

What's not to understand, people with money want to make more money.

[The Leader]

I don't want to have to wait for a specialist when I could just pay for treatment right away. It's selfish, but I don't give a fuck because my parents have money.

[Fathom Zero]

I've seen what government health care is like. They nearly operated on the wrong foot on me. Fucking idiot doctors.

[Dr. Boogie]

They're convinced that a government-run health care program will fail because it will be run by the government, which is bad whenever the government isn't being run by a republican. Also, they loathe spending money on anything other than defense.

Everything else, including talk of "death panels" and such, is just crap they're throwing out to try and scare the public into backing them.

[Command Prompt]

I guess my main question is, are conservatives actually this stupid, and fail to understand how having a socialized health care system is cheaper in the long run, or has it really boiled down to partisanship, and they don't vote for it, simply because they hate all the people that will vote for it.

I mean, in Canada, the fraction of a penny I pay in taxes for helping other Canadians out is fine by me, because, even if I wasn't trying to be altruistic about it, it would still be in my best interest to help out others, all the time, because the guy who can afford his health care will probably not end up a criminal and possibly steal my shit. That's kind of a big stretch but, really, its not that illogical, is it?

That seems to be the main argument I hear from the republicans, that they cannot see how it's their responsibility to pay for the health of someone else. Is anyone else confused by how a minimal investment in someone elses' welfare will pay off, even if its for selfish reasons?

[Dimnos]

I can afford my own health care. I couldnt care less about universal health care as long I dont have to pay for it.

[Tadao]

I guess my main question is, are conservatives actually this stupid, and fail to understand how having a socialized health care system is cheaper in the long run, or has it really boiled down to partisanship, and they don't vote for it, simply because they hate all the people that will vote for it.

I mean, in Canada, the fraction of a penny I pay in taxes for helping other Canadians out is fine by me, because, even if I wasn't trying to be altruistic about it, it would still be in my best interest to help out others, all the time, because the guy who can afford his health care will probably not end up a criminal and possibly steal my shit. That's kind of a big stretch but, really, its not that illogical, is it?

That seems to be the main argument I hear from the republicans, that they cannot see how it's their responsibility to pay for the health of someone else. Is anyone else confused by how a minimal investment in someone elses' welfare will pay off, even if its for selfish reasons?

So you kinda just decided to not read my post then.

[kahljorn]

As a conservative I don't want the governmunt to interfere with my healthcare. I'm happy with my medi-cal and I don't need the government messing it up or changing it.

[Dimnos]

GET A JOB YOU HIPPIES!

[MetalMilitia]

If the proposed system is anything like England's you are still more than welcome to have private healthcare if you want to pay for it. If you can't afford it, you can use the NHS.

What's wrong with that? All the people that don't want no governments messin' in their affairs can continue to use private healthcare. Everyone else can get it for free.

[The Leader]

But that's lost revenue.

[Tadao]

In a big way, why not feed everyone for free? Because it won't make me money.

[kahljorn]

I DONT WANT HE GOVERNMENT INTERFFERRRN WITH MY MEDIIICCAAAAAAAAL

:(

[kahljorn]

I think for a lot of people public healthcare has become like a symbol of everything unamerican.

[Dimnos]

All I want to know is how much is going to be taken out of my paycheck every week so some junkie can get his pain pills?

[Command Prompt]

All I want to know is how much is going to be taken out of my paycheck every week so some junkie can get his pain pills?

Is this seriously how the conservatives actually think? Or are you just trolling?

[Colonel Flagg]

All I want to know is how much is going to be taken out of my paycheck every week so some junkie can get his pain pills?

You mean like Rush Limbaugh? :rolleyes

[The Leader]

Is this seriously how the conservatives actually think? Or are you just trolling?
What site are we on?

[Dimnos]

Is this seriously how the conservatives actually think? Or are you just trolling?

No. I really want to know how much they are going to take out of my check every week. Seams like a legitimate question.

[Dr. Boogie]

I guess my main question is, are conservatives actually this stupid, and fail to understand how having a socialized health care system is cheaper in the long run, or has it really boiled down to partisanship, and they don't vote for it, simply because they hate all the people that will vote for it.

I mean, in Canada, the fraction of a penny I pay in taxes for helping other Canadians out is fine by me, because, even if I wasn't trying to be altruistic about it, it would still be in my best interest to help out others, all the time, because the guy who can afford his health care will probably not end up a criminal and possibly steal my shit. That's kind of a big stretch but, really, its not that illogical, is it?

That seems to be the main argument I hear from the republicans, that they cannot see how it's their responsibility to pay for the health of someone else. Is anyone else confused by how a minimal investment in someone elses' welfare will pay off, even if its for selfish reasons?

Among the core beliefs of the Republican party are the idea that taxes are bad, no matter what they're used for, and that the government should rarely be involved in anything, which is mostly just an extrapolation of the first bit.

Beyond that, there's the idea that if there is a government program that is helping people with something, said program is doomed to be abused by people, and thus should never be attempted. You take a complete lack of faith in other people, add in the belief that everyone should just fend for themselves, and you've got a fair idea of what's going through the heads of a lot of modern conservatives.

[VaporTrailx1]

I just have no faith in the government running anything. How many congressmen does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

[Dimnos]

None. But it does take a majority vote to hire one guy to oversee the project that is managed by another guy. Who hires one more to buy the bulb and another to pick it up and deliver it to the job site. He then has to hire yet another guy to pick it up again and actually deliver it to the correct job site who passes it off to a final guy to actually screw it in.

[Jeanette X]

I just have no faith in the government running anything. How many congressmen does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

Just two, but good luck getting them in there.

:lol2

[Wiffles]

I think its the red tape and bureaucracy that makes healthcare complicated and expensive. Something government run healthcare has less thereoff.

[Command Prompt]

No. I really want to know how much they are going to take out of my check every week. Seams like a legitimate question.


Does your paycheck specify how much municipal tax goes towards roads that are walked on by bums and junkies who don't pay taxes?

Or how much of your taxes go towards free primary and secondary education for people who have children when you probably don't?

Does it specify how much was spent on police that were sent to protect an individual getting beat up who may have been a bum or junkie?

I don't understand how you can pick one government service, that should be available, (and is available, in every developed country except for yours), and ask for specifics, when you probably don't care about the ones that already are.

I mean, seriously, a bum, walking on the same roads that a taxpaying citizen uses. The nerve.


Furthermore, do any of you have any health care stories to share? Being fucked over by the system? Etc?

[Dr. Boogie]

I just have no faith in the government running anything. How many congressmen does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

I don't think a government-run plan would run 100%, but worst case scenario, people would have mediocre health care instead of no health care.

Also, anyone who thinks government health care would drive private insurers out of business ought to check and make sure that UPS and FedEx went out of business when the postal system came into being.

[Blasted Child]

The biggest problem is that the republicans throw in so much hate-propaganda that it's hard to maintain a pertinent debate.

A prime example being the Stephen Hawking affair:
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_08/019457.php

Basically an American newspaper editorial claimed that if Hawking had lived in the UK, he wouldn't be alive today (because the NHS doesn't bother to keep ill elderly alive there).

The had failed to realize that Hawking is a British resident, he has been treated by the NHS throughout his life and he is in fact alive.

[Command Prompt]

Well, to be fair, Politicians aren't known for honesty. To be honest, its the level of the misinformation that's insulting.

30 years ago, Reagan took the time to explain to everyone his plan for supply side economics, and why he thought it was the bee's knees. Technically, he was giving misinformation, because he didn't mention all the other things that would (and did) come with it, such as capital flight, and huge rollbacks of private sector regulation.

But at least he talked to the public like they had a brain, and were capable of critical thinking.

Now all they do is hop on TV and come up with a stupid phrase, like DEATH PANELS and that's good enough. They know you're not even going to think about it, and the (lack of) effort they put in clearly shows it.

[Dimnos]

Does your paycheck specify how much municipal tax goes towards roads that are walked on by bums and junkies who don't pay taxes?

Or how much of your taxes go towards free primary and secondary education for people who have children when you probably don't?

Does it specify how much was spent on police that were sent to protect an individual getting beat up who may have been a bum or junkie?

The difference between a roads education and the police is that all those services I actually use. I drive on those roads too. When I was a kid I attended school. Now that I have kids of my own they go to school. And the police are there for everyone (for better or worse, thats a different matter all together). I never said universal health care was a bad thing. All I want to know is how much of my money the government is going to be taking out of my pocket. Or in other words... What is the bottom line? Is that really such a jerk thing to ask?

I don't understand how you can pick one government service, that should be available, (and is available, in every developed country except for yours), and ask for specifics, when you probably don't care about the ones that already are.

Actually I do care about the ones we already have but again thats a different matter all together. Im only talking about universal health care because that is the topic at hand. In a thread that you started if Im correct. So if anyone singled it out its you.

[ZeldaQueen]

I don't think a government-run plan would run 100%, but worst case scenario, people would have mediocre health care instead of no health care.

It's going to go the way any new program goes: start off and be fixed and tweaked as time goes by. Just like the Constitution. I might be wrong, but I don't think any program like this would be made, tossed out, and left as is forever.

[Command Prompt]

All I want to know is how much is going to be taken out of my paycheck every week so some junkie can get his pain pills?

When you asked the question like this, you weren't exactly asking what the bottom line was, so much as you were subtly inferring that people who will be getting the health care are people you feel don't deserve it.

And there isn't really a difference, unless you are saying that you wouldn't use the public option. Your for-profit insurance provider has covered every medical condition you have, and will continue to do so?

That's good for you man, because an ever increasing majority of people in your country are not in the same boat. Or arc, I guess, is more appropriate.

If you've never gotten a letter in the mail saying that you are denied coverage because the insurance company feels that your condition was pre-existing, or that the treatment is considered to "experimental" and you will owe the hospital $50,000, then you are pretty lucky.

I never have either, but that's because I was blessed enough to have been born in Canada, and I would not think twice about the fraction of a penny that goes towards helping other Canadians get adequate health care.

To be honest, the fact that Americans are willing to hold other Americans financially responsible for something like getting sick honestly makes ME sick.

[Tadao]

Does your paycheck specify how much municipal tax goes towards roads that are walked on by bums and junkies who don't pay taxes?

Or how much of your taxes go towards free primary and secondary education for people who have children when you probably don't?

Does it specify how much was spent on police that were sent to protect an individual getting beat up who may have been a bum or junkie?

I don't understand how you can pick one government service, that should be available, (and is available, in every developed country except for yours), and ask for specifics, when you probably don't care about the ones that already are.

I mean, seriously, a bum, walking on the same roads that a taxpaying citizen uses. The nerve.


Furthermore, do any of you have any health care stories to share? Being fucked over by the system? Etc?

Are you sayiong he doesn't need to know this info and should just fucking shut up?

[The Leader]

Hey Command Prompt, maybe if you got a job and stopped mooching off of other people then you wouldn't need hardworking people to pay their hard earned money just so you could get your fix. Fucking hippy.

[Command Prompt]

Are you sayiong he doesn't need to know this info and should just fucking shut up?

I'd actually prefer he defend himself as intelligently as possible,

but shutting the fuck up is also a fairly reasonable alternative to asking banal, loaded questions.

A job? You mean like being an associate sociology professor at university? I'll look into it.

[Dimnos]

All I want to know is how much is going to be taken out of my paycheck every week...

This is what people who have any sort of education call a question.

...so some junkie can get his pain pills?

This is what anyone on these boards, aside from you apparently, would call a joke.

So your universal health care in Canada only costs you a "fraction of a penny"? Really? Thats all? I find that hard to believe. Im not saying it has to cost a ton every week, but it has to cost more than a "fraction of a penny".

Again I have never said I wouldnt go for it. I just want to know how much it is going to cost and if I will be forced to put into it if I have my own insurance. These are perfectly acceptable questions.

To be honest, the fact that Americans are willing to hold other Americans financially responsible for something like getting sick honestly makes ME sick

OMG! How dare we hold you responsible for yourself! Its a crime against humanity to expect you to get a job and provide for yourself! As far as those who just cant be expected to...

Hey T do you have a job? Do your medical bill get paid? Who pays for them?

[Command Prompt]

I agree that lifestyle is an important factor in many conditions, however genetics and other random factors still play a large role in determining the quality of life for many people. Everyone actually.

Holding people personally responsible for random variations in the gene pool is like saying the weather personally makes conscious decisions.

Essentially, the only way you can justify this line of thinking is by giving sway to some kind of hard determinism, in which certain people are created to be "better" than others, and everyone else just has to "deal with it."

[Tadao]

Hey T do you have a job? Do your medical bill get paid? Who pays for them?

I am going on 39 and my government (THE GREAT U.S. of FUCKING A.) is providing me with free health care and a small amount of money to see me through via U.S. Social Security.

[Tadao]

I remember when my wife got sick, it's to bad I couldn't rush her into the hospital and get her taken care of and have medi-cal take care of the bill because we were to poor to pay it. Oh wait... they did!

[Dimnos]

But I thought we were heartless bastards who didnt care for anyone who couldnt take care of themselves?! Oh wait... Its only the dick lickers who are perfectly able to provide for themselves but chose to abuse the system that we dont like.


To be honest, the fact that Americans are willing to hold other Americans financially responsible for something like getting sick honestly makes ME sick.

I guess this would be statement from an uninformed blow hard. I suppose you study up a little more before passing judgment professor.

[Tadao]

When I was a bum in San Fransisco, I couldn't go into any thing like a free health clinic to get medical attention for the smallest of injuries or coughs, OH WAIT! I DID!

[Tadao]

I HAVE OPINIONS ON THINGS OUTSIDE MY KNOWLEDGE!

[Tadao]

But since I do know a thing or two about it, Dimnos, I think who it would benefit the most is people who do have private health care and have a previous condition that the private health care system won't support. You guys would be able to actually get what you are paying for this time and have the best of both worlds. As much as I like making Canadians fustrated, the truth is that your kid will have a better chance to grow up healthy in an increasingly poisoned atmosphere.

No one knows what is going to happen to them illnesswise. I thought my back problems were just normal back problems. If I had access to health care back then I would have been able to have the problem slowed down to where I could be working for another 10 - 20 years and paying taxes. But back then it was all, have some aspirin and exercise cause everyone has back pain and we aren't gonna do xrays for free I don't feel anything wrong man up you pussy.

[Dimnos]

Right. It could be a great thing. I just want to know how much it will cost and what difference there is between it and the insurance I already have? Will it cover more or less than what I have? If I like my insurance better do I have to buy into it? A little more info is all I need, but Im open to the idea.

[Tadao]

All very reasonable questions that I don't think are answered yet. But then again, I haven't read the bill.

[Tadao]

The thing I see the most is that people with private health care get an illness and the insurance will do everything possible to not cover you for it. Under the plan (I am assuming) you are covered for everything.

[The Leader]

A job? You mean like being an associate sociology professor at university? I'll look into it.
No, I mean a real job.

[Dimnos]

Sociology. :lol

[Dimnos]

At university

[kahljorn]

So if the government already provides healthcare via medical and other programs which likely receive government incentives what is the difference if it is just standardized into one program? Obviously, money is already coming out of sweet dimnos pocket to pay for tadao's wife's sickness, so financially, how much of a difference is it going to make?
The only difference it should make is that more people will be receiving it, who either didn't know about the program or were ineligible since these programs often have weird rules.

Also, if everybody has healthcare, more problems like tadao's can be prevented which will keep people off of social security and other programs which take money out of your pocket. As it is people who are fat and useless get more health and financial care than other persons; it's almost an incentive to become useless.
Personally I think if the government tried to enforce more healthy living on people that are sucking off of its teet we'd be a lot better... like incentives for eatting and living healthy. Same with food stamps.
but that might be too unamerican :(

[Tadao]

I think it will be hard on people who are working in the beginning, but after a solid amount of time, preventive medicine and good health will have a chance at a better, fit and working America. Also we might gain back a little of that compassion that we lost in the 80s.

[Dimnos]

sweet dimnos

I knew you cared! :)

[kahljorn]

I'm a very loving and caring person.

;)

[Zhukov]

Well, it certainly hasn't worked in other countries around the world, so I don't see it happening in USA.

Australia is a fucking hell hole nowadays. fat, lazy thieves who just drink tax dollars all day roam the streets unfetted. Bring back capital punishment, I say. Certainly can't hurt.

[Dimnos]

Bring back capital punishment, I say. Certainly can't hurt.

We still do in the great state of Texas. I thought you Aussies were still real men and did too?

[Command Prompt]

you are all just awful, awful people. But I love you all anyway.

[Dimnos]

Awful? Because we kill child rapists?

[Tadao]

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/4967/outrageous.jpg

[Zhukov]

We still do in the great state of Texas. I thought you Aussies were still real men and did too?

No, we haven't hypocriticaly taken the life of someone since 1967. To top it off, the last man hanged wasn't even guilty.

Also, Tadao; imagine if they put a crazy looking donkey driving a beat up old clown ambulance, and the brave, stong elephant was using his tank to defend children from terrorsits - I bet then you wouldn't want any health care reforms.

[Tadao]

OUTRAGEOUS!

[executioneer]

terrorsits
terrorsits was my nickname back in highschool ;_;

[Dimnos]

No, we haven't hypocriticaly taken the life of someone since 1967. To top it off, the last man hanged wasn't even guilty.


The last guy we killed here in Texas...

The U.S. Supreme Court on Wednesday refused to review the case of a Tarrant County man who confessed to fatally shooting five relatives and was condemned for the deaths of two of them, his stepchildren gunned down while they slept.

The high court's refusal moves Terry Lee Hankins closer to execution for the 2001 slayings of Kevin Galley, 12, and Ashley Mason, 11. Their bodies and the body of their mother, 34-year-old Tammy Hankins, were found in their mobile home in Mansfield, about 20 miles southeast of Fort Worth

We wont kill you just for killing someone. We kill you for killing and/or raping children. That shit dont fly around here. Hardly hypocrisy if you ask me.

[The Leader]

DON'T MESS WITH TEXAS

[Dimnos]

Damn straight.

[Tadao]

Anyone who applies for medi-state or medi-care will tell you that you will be lucky to get it even if you have a fat proof that you need it. It's a full time job trying to get it and I was lucky to have help from a lawyer and family. Most people wind up unable to keep up with the system and finally kill themselves instead just to ease the pain.

Sorry to damper things, but it's an ugly reality that we are letting the system keep people in need in an endless loop of appointments and paperwork to get something they or their family most likely paid into. Why is SS failing, well maybe because we let our government dip into it to pay for other needed things and don't hold them accountable for it.

Blah blah blah.

http://douggeivett.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/soapbox1.jpg

[kahljorn]

It's a full time job trying to get it and I was lucky to have help from a lawyer and family.Quite true :(

somebody needs to start a capital punishment thread ;D i got toooooons of fun arguments for (and against) that.

[Colonel Flagg]

somebody needs to start a capital punishment thread

Go ahead - make my day. :clint

;)

[kahljorn]

Just don't cry about it later ;)

[Sparkles the Fairy]

I cannot offer you health insurance, but I can put a poultice of clean spider web silk around around any cuts you may have. :\

[Wiffles]

Wow Fairy has healing properties O.O

*Duly noted*

[Dimnos]

I cannot offer you health insurance, but I can put a poultice of clean spider web silk around around any cuts you may have. :\

Man it sure is getting gay in here. >:

[Sparkles the Fairy]

Man it sure is getting gay in here. >:

Gay? Wonderful! It is my goal to make things more merry! :)

[Colonel Flagg]

Man it sure is getting gay in here. >:

You noticed too, eh?

STF, go post in Hangie's gay thread, please. >:

[Sparkles the Fairy]

You noticed too, eh?

STF, go post in Hangie's gay thread, please. >:

Make me, mortal. >:

[Dimnos]

Who needs to make anyone when you can simply be put on ignore. Bye forever retard. :lol

[The Leader]

That's a good idea.

[Colonel Flagg]

Why didn't I think of that? Thanks Dim IOU one. :)

[AChimp]

I'm kinda surprised that this thread isn't getting much attention. I'm not surprised by some of the ass-clownery I've read here, though.

http://www.newsweek.com/id/215290/page/1

This is a pretty good article that basically contrasts the view of health care in the U.S. against the view in other industrialized nations.

IMO, it really comes down to whether or not you believe medical care is a right or something that should be auctioned off to the highest bidder. Of course, as a Canadian, I'm a pinko commie when it comes to my health care. :)

[Dimnos]

This thread died when that fairy gayed it up. :(

[Dimnos]

That and close minded fools thought I was right out against it because I had the audacity to throw in a joke while asking a few questions.

[Tadao]

"Us Canadians, we're kind of understated by nature," Marcus Davies told me in his soft-spoken way. "We don't go around chanting 'We're No. 1!' But you know, there are two areas where we feel superior to the U.S.: hockey and health care."

Ummm When was the last time you had the Stanley Cup? After a comment like that, how can I even begin to listen to you're anti America based view.

[Dimnos]

My favorite part was

"They love to point out that Canada provides coverage for everybody, usually with no copay and no deductible—while the U.S. leaves tens of millions of its citizens uninsured."

"They love to remind us that, while the U.S. lets some 700,000 people go bankrupt due to medical bills each year, the number of medical bankruptcies in Canada is precisely zero."

Yes we LOVE to point that out. If we point something out about Canada its that your cheese loving Frenchies. :rolleyes

[Tadao]

:we're#1highfive

[Kitsa]

"we won't say that we're better, it's just that we're less worse." -The Arrogant Worms

(boring video but I linked for the song)

-y-9ViORazI

[Tadao]

I really do find it amazing that these experts fully believe that if someone is sick or dying, they won't be treated. Hell, all you have to do is walk into an emergency room and you can not be refused treatment. I'm not saying that it's as apparently perfect as the rest of the world, but the rest of the world seems to be as full of shit as the politicians here. OMG, you know what? People actually can get help with no money! Illegals do it all the fucking time. The main problem is that most people don't go see the Dr. until it's too late. That is completely our fault and universal health care isn't gonna get the cowboys in to get a check up.

[Dimnos]

I think a lot of people look at it as if we are trying to deny people of something when in reality we are trying to encourage self growth and responsibility. I know the American work ethic isnt what it used to be but the idea that you have to provide for yourself is a reflection of it.

[Tadao]

What drives this country is fear. I believe that if we had socialized medicine, the fear of seeing a Dr. would go away and America would be healthier. Right now a lot of people don't know that there is free help for the poor. The middle class are the ones who really get fucked. You have a job and no insurance? Well if you don't get rich fast you are about to be poor.

All these people outside of America telling Americans that we let people die in the streets AREN'T FUCKING HELPING THE CAUSE! We know when we smell bullshit, and that is a big fucking heap of shit. So what is the automatic reaction, to keep it away until we can separate the lies from the truth. Great job outsiders. You're like the guy who steps on a branch during a raid.

[Dimnos]

:lol

[Dimnos]

Best argument against socialized medicine in the USA...

YOU CANT TRUST CAPITALIST POLITICIANS NOT TO FUCK IT UP!

[Tadao]

Seriously. My brother is huge into Wall Street, and the word is, buy Pharmaceuticals. Just because we get "free" health care doesn't mean we get good health care.

[Dimnos]

I love to buy pharmaceuticals. :yum

[Tadao]

TX is awfully close to Mexico ;)

[Dimnos]

Mexicans are bringing it closer and closer every year.

[Tadao]

I'm kinda surprised that this thread isn't getting much attention. I'm not surprised by some of the ass-clownery I've read here, though.

http://www.newsweek.com/id/215290/page/1

This is a pretty good article that basically contrasts the view of health care in the U.S. against the view in other industrialized nations.

IMO, it really comes down to whether or not you believe medical care is a right or something that should be auctioned off to the highest bidder. Of course, as a Canadian, I'm a pinko commie when it comes to my health care. :)

In the spirit of thing, let me post a link from my home county.

http://www.venturacountystar.com/news/2009/sep/15/canadians-divided-on-government-healthcare/?partner=yahoo_headlines

[Dimnos]

Personally I only know one Canadian. She HATES Canadian health care and is totally against us going to socialized medicine

[Zhukov]

Didn't Canada beat the US in a war?

[Dimnos]

Didn't Canada beat the US in a war?


Kraft Dinner war maybe. :lol

[Zhukov]

Or the war of 1812 or something.

[Dimnos]

The war of 1812 was more or less our 2nd war for Independence fought against the British. The British occupied Canada at the time and they pushed into parts of the USA and we pushed into parts of Canada. Ultimately neither side "won" anything but much like our actual war for independence the British decided it was more trouble than we were worth. In the end they gave back the few parts of the USA they occupied in return for the few parts of Canada that we occupied. If you want to say anyone won anything in that war is was Andrew Jackson in the southern part of the USA.

[AChimp]

Canadian and British troops also burned down Washington and stole a painting. :O

Anyways, no one's claiming that the Canadian public health care system is perfect; there's a lot of things wrong with it. The problem with wait times usually comes down to a lack of resources.

If there was more capacity, wait times would come down. If there's only one MRI machine, and it can only do 30 scans per day, bitching about it won't make the machine work any faster. Adding more machines would help, but they cost millions of dollars which is paid for by the government, which has to spread the money around to everything. Private hospitals in the US can do whatever they want with their profits, so if adding more equipment brings in more patients, then that's what they do.

If you're looking for elective surgery, you're going to wait because you're not allowed to pay more to skip to the front of the line. People who think they're the most important person in the world travel to the US to visit private clinics, and these are usually the cases that you see covered in the media. These people didn't NEED treatment or they wanted it faster.

If you visit an emergency room, yeah, you're probably going to have to wait due to something called triage. When people who are in worse shape than you show up, they're moved to the front of the line because they need the attention right away. And honestly, a lot of people visit emergency rooms for bullshit reasons because of a false sense of entitlement.

Nobody has to worry about how they're going to pay for a visit to the hospital, though. Nobody has to worry about money if their kid gets sick and needs a bunch of medicine. Nobody has to worry about whether or not they can afford to even SEE a doctor if they feel sick.

[Dimnos]

What painting did you guys take?

[The Leader]

The US realized that they were beat and started the peace negotiations. The idea that the war of 1812 was a second revolution for Americans is a fallacy. The only thing the US got out of it was a really big flag and a nifty song. That and Canada was a part of the British empire so of course it was occupied by British troops. We invaded them, not the other way around.

[Dimnos]

A fallacy? It started because Britain was getting their asses handed to them in the Napoleonic Wars and thought they could hurt France financially and benefit themselves by setting up a naval blockade to halt American and French trading. They tried to force us to trade only with them much like they did before the Revolutionary war with the Navigation Acts but this time with their Navy as opposed to laws. Not to mention they were basically kidnapping our sailors and forcing them into their Navy. America declared war on Britain because they basically refused to acknowledge our sovereignty. Hence why it is referred to as the 2nd revolution.

[The Leader]

Yeah, and we got our asses handed to us.

[Zhukov]

America failed to achieve it's military objectives, Britain/Canada succeded in achieving theirs.

It's like thinking the Vietnam war was a draw because the Viet Cong never captured the White House.

[Dimnos]

Um... What fucking objectives are you talking about? As far as I know the British blockade ended and they stopped kidnapping our sailors. Beyond that our objective was to defend ourselves and we did. Boston remained ours. So did New Orleans. America still flies Old Glory. Yeah we sure got our asses handed to us. :rolleyes

[The Leader]

The British blockade ended because Napoleon was finally defeated and they no longer needed it. They stopped kidnapping our sailors for the same reason. The British trashed Washington D.C., the Battle of New Orleans took place after the peace treaty had been signed, etc, etc. The United States is the only country where it's taught that the US won the War of 1812. For some reason I don't think that the rest of the world is wrong, especially when you actually read about the war.

[Zhukov]

The capture and control of Canada was Americas prime objective, the defense of it was the British/Canadian one. Right?

Also, this "still flying old glory!" is the exact reason I mentioned the Vietnam example. Just because the enemy doesn't raze your cities and annihilate your people doesn't mean you don't lose. :rolleyes

Anyway, I'm not going to pretend I know all about this war; my understanding of it was what I have already said, and that it ended with a peace treaty where everybody got their land back and the US was allowed to fish in some river.

Back to Health Care!

What AChimp said about wait times being the major problem is true here too. In fact it's going to be true to any public health system running at the moment I'd wager. Relying on the government to provide those MRI machines can be frustrating, but having one overworked machine is better than none for most people, and I would be much more frustrated knowing I had no security should some sort of accident befall me. I honestly have trust in the Australian health system to look after me when I get sick/injured. I don't pay extra for private health because of that trust, and so far it's going well for me.

I'm happy for the guy with the nail through his skull to skip ahead of me in the Emergency line. I can see people thinking that more money means working harder, means more rewards means more chance of surviving an accident, though. I guess I just don't see it that way.

[Dimnos]

You have to look at world events leading up to and during that time. Napoleon was rampaging France and its allies all over Europe. Britain couldnt match his army but he couldnt match their navy. Militarily speaking they really couldnt do much to eachother so they resorted to a more economic warfare. Napoleon cut Britain off from trade with continental Europe. Britain couldnt really cut France off from trade with anyone inside continental Europe because of Napoleons superior army so they had to use their superior navy to cut off as much of his shipping trade as they could. Most of which was done with America at the time. Now Europe has many major ports all over the place where America only had a few major ports namely Baltimore, New York and New Orleans. It would be easier for Britain to block America off from France so that is what they did. They set up a naval blockade and started kidnapping American sailors and were forcing them to join the Royal Navy. America looked at this as an infringement on their sovereignty and that is why they went to war. Due to Britains naval superiority they couldnt just sail out their and start blowing them out of the water. Their only other option was to attack the British in Canada. Their objective was not to take Canada per se, it was to end the blockade and to make sure their sailors would no longer be kidnapped.

The reason I bring up that we still fly Old Glory is because as AChimp said they did capture Washington DC and did burn and loot many government buildings. Alternately we did capture and burn York. The War of 1812 took place in North America not on the other side of the globe like Vietnam.

Yes the battle of New Orleans did take place after the peace treaty but it was Britain that attacked and America that defended the city. Yet despite being outnumbered 3 to 1 Andrew Jackson kicked their asses.

[The Leader]

Because he's Andrew mother fucking Jackson. He's the exception to the rule.

[Dimnos]

http://www.insidesocal.com/bargain/TwentyDollarBill.jpg

Dont even fuck with Old Hickory! >:

[Colonel Flagg]

This thread is out of control. :bestthread

[Dimnos]

Thats the way we like it. :)

[Dimnos]

So rationing of care is not Death Panels? Your lack of logic amazes me.

By this logic we already have "death panels" whether or not they work for an insurance company the government or even a hospital. Someone is always rationing health care. :rolleyes

FactCheck is absolutely unreliable for numerous reasons. First reason is that it's run by a private family (Foundation's are used by the rich for social manipulation and tax avoidance on their large sums of money),

By this logic no one can trust anyone anywhere anytime. You might as well hole up in your closet with a shotgun and be prepared to blast anyone who knocks on your door while you contemplate turning the gun on yourself. :\


P.S. ~ Here is the health care thread that is apparently so fucking hard to find. I present it to you so you dont give the Colonel a brain aneurysm. Hmm... Guess Im rationing health care. I must be a one man DEATH PANEL! :hypno

[TheCoolinator]

By this logic we already have "death panels" whether or not they work for an insurance company the government or even a hospital. Someone is always rationing health care.

You left out how this new "health care" bill doesn't do anything to stop the rationing of care from Government / private interests, actually bails them out of their derivative debts, and forces you to buy a product from a for profit company while cutting more funding for social safety nets.

They could of passed a law that would ban death panels (rationing of care) but they didn't THE HEALTH CARE BILLIS A FARCE, A RUSE, A SHAME, its blatant and obvious. It has death panels, it has rationing of care, it is run by private for-profit insurance companies.....this isn't difficult to understand.



By this logic no one can trust anyone anywhere anytime.

No, that's your backwards and counter productive logic. If that were true then I wouldn't have used the World Net Daily article to back up my point but I looked it over did some fact checking (no pun intended) and found out there was no faults in the summary that Richard Poe wrote up.

You have to come to your own conclusions. You can't adhere to any kind of biased if you want to think objectively, empirically and or rationally.

think. please. I beg you.

[Colonel Flagg]

We are thinking. You however, are bleating and babbling without making much coherence. Much like a lost sheep.

Just sayin'.

[TheCoolinator]

We are thinking. You however, are bleating and babbling without making much coherence. Much like a lost sheep.

Just sayin'.


Prove me wrong, o' scholar. Show us what that big "degree" can do then. Come on.

Say something else other than these infantile little snipes and grumbles from the backround. I dare you. :love

[Colonel Flagg]

Nope.

Every time anyone tries to make a cogent rebuttal to your mounds and mounds of links, opinions, and general breast-beating, you either do one of two things:

1. Ignore the post and repeat near verbatim your last few posts on the subject, as if repeating them would make them any more believable, or

2. Call the poster names like "lemming" or "puppet" and do the same as step 1.

Having an intellectual discussion with you is like talking to a window. Except the window has more interesting things to say.

EDIT: Prove me wrong. Discuss the issues with The Leader. I DARE YOU! (in a non-judgemental non-confrontational manner, as bespeaks a man of culture and breeding, of course. :posh)

[The Leader]

He has been, it's just that he's right and I've been brainwashed and the best way to beat brainwashing is to repeat yourself over and over.

[TheCoolinator]

Nope.

Every time anyone tries to make a cogent rebuttal to your mounds and mounds of links, opinions, and general breast-beating, you either do one of two things:

I guess having an independent opinion backed up by information is against the social norm now a days. I have to start remembering that we all have to think and act the like a hive.

Bzzzzzzz. Hope and Change. bzzzzzzzz

He has been, it's just that he's right and I've been brainwashed and the best way to beat brainwashing is to repeat yourself over and over.

I wouldn't say brainwashed. More like conditioned similar to Pavlov's Dog.

(Rings Bell)

[The Leader]

:lol

[Dimnos]

No, that's your backwards and counter productive logic. If that were true then I wouldn't have used the World Net Daily article to back up my point but I looked it over did some fact checking (no pun intended) and found out there was no faults in the summary that Richard Poe wrote up.

So The Leader cant use FactCheck.org but you can use the World Net Daily?! FactCheck at least claims to be non-partisan. WND is openly conservative. I have read over many things at FactCheck and they have never shown themselves to favor one side. WND generally and openly favors the right. You then give The Leader shit for distrusting O'Reilly when you yourself said...


I really don't know how people take any of them seriously. Everything is already written for them and downloaded into their teleprompters before they even get to work, they self censor themselves, and are in the tank whoever pays the most.

and...

You guys really believe that all the talking heads, left or right, are really pushing their own ideologies? You don't think they are reading from a pre-written script?

Hell you yourself dont trust the guy. YOU SAID SO YOURSELF. So why isnt it ok for him to be distrustful?


Beyond that show me an article where FactCheck got it blatantly wrong.

Not to mention in the past WND has said FactCheck is correct and agreed with them on at least one occasion on the subject of Obamas birth certificate.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=73214

However, FactChecker.org (http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html) says it obtained Obama's actual certification of live birth and that the document was indeed real. The site discredited some of the claims of Internet bloggers, such as that the certificate as viewed in a scanned copy released by Obama's campaign lacked a raised seal. FactChecker.org also established that many of the alleged flaws in the document noted by bloggers were caused by the scanning of the document.
A separate WND investigation into Obama's certification of live birth utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic. The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren't originally there.


So if they guys you are saying are true and correct say FactCheck is true and correct... :\




But Im getting away from my original point. You said you cant trust organizations because they lie but then expect us to trust this other organization just because? And IM the one with "backwards and counter productive" logic?! :confused: Go screw yourself is probably the nicest thing I can really respond to that with.

[Dimnos]

I wouldn't say brainwashed. More like conditioned similar to Pavlov's Dog.

(Rings Bell)

God your a fucking tool. You have been saying The Leader (and all the rest of us) have been fed incorrect info so that we believe what "they" want us to. THAT IS FUCKING BRAINWASHED. For it to be anything similar to Pavlovs Dog The Leader (and the rest of us) would have to be getting some "reward" for an "action" that would make us want to repeat said "action". Quit trying to pull shit out of your ass to sound smart you fucking retard. At the beginning of this debate, although full of shit, you at least argued your shit in a moderately respectable way. Now you are just grasping at straws and quickly making this not worth anyones time. As if trying to talk to someone as close minded with their head up their ass as you was ever worth it.

[TheCoolinator]

So The Leader cant use FactCheck.org but you can use the World Net Daily?! FactCheck at least claims to be non-partisan. WND is openly conservative. I have read over many things at FactCheck and they have never shown themselves to favor one side. WND generally and openly favors the right. You then give The Leader shit for distrusting O'Reilly when you yourself said...

TheLeader can use whatever information he pleases, all I did was give an indepth history of who FactCheck is, which foundation they are tied too, and who worked for them in the past (OBAMA).

Even if WND says they are "conservative" that's completely irrelevant because it's the information in the article I was speaking about not the altruistic nature of World net Daily.



So why isnt it ok for him to be distrustful?

God help us.....

TheLeader has every right to be distrustful of whomever he pleases BUT he used a discredited talking head teleprompter reader from the "right" persuasion in a ham fisted attempt to discredit my article. You can't just say a person's name who is a villian and attach them to anything you want to attack on the basis of nothing.

The article I posted was about the Obama health care monstrosity. NOT ABOUT BILL O'REILLY. They have nothing to do with each other.

See? get it?






Not to mention in the past WND has said FactCheck is correct and agreed with them on at least one occasion on the subject of Obamas birth certificate.


Drew Zahn agreed with Factcheck.....Not WND......WND is a news website.....Drew Zahn is a writer. She doesn't speak for her entire paper.



But Im getting away from my original point. You said you cant trust organizations because they lie .

No, what I said is that people can absorb any information they wish but one must come to an independent conclusion on them.

Example:
However, FactChecker.org (http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html) says it obtained Obama's actual certification of live birth and that the document was indeed real. The site discredited some of the claims of Internet bloggers, such as that the certificate as viewed in a scanned copy released by Obama's campaign lacked a raised seal. FactChecker.org also established that many of the alleged flaws in the document noted by bloggers were caused by the scanning of the document. A separate WND investigation into Obama's certification of live birth utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic. The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren't originally there.


^ This quote is all fine and dandy BUT they don't mention that Obama has spent over 2 MILLION dollars fighting legal battles concealing his birth certificate.

That's 2 MILLION dollars of legal costs to hide something and who are those "experts" they are talking about and wouldn't those bloggers who added text be in jail for falsifing a legal document? Who are these experts? Why haven't they talked about the 2 million in legal fees paid to lawyers to fight cases that want to see his documentation?

See?


AND!!!!!

Did you even read the editors notes?

(Editor's note: WND's investigation into the certification of live birth did not include inspecting the actual document, but only asking experts to evaluate the online image. Those experts, therefore, could not "prove" the document's authenticity. The experts told WND merely that many of the forgery claims made against the image were inconclusive or falsified, leaving them no evidence that would cast doubt on the image's authenticity.)

[Dimnos]

TheLeader can use whatever information he pleases, all I did was give an indepth history of who FactCheck is, which foundation they are tied too, and who worked for them in the past (OBAMA).

In an attempt to discredit them by saying they are bias towards Obama. :rolleyes

Even if WND says they are "conservative" that's completely irrelevant because it's the information in the article I was speaking about not the altruistic nature of World net Daily.

This is a valid point because you tried to discredit FacCheck by saying they were bias but then use your own bias source. Psst... This makes you a hypocrite.


TheLeader has every right to be distrustful of whomever he pleases BUT he used a discredited talking head teleprompter reader from the "right" persuasion in a ham fisted attempt to discredit my article. You can't just say a person who is a villian and attach his or her name to anything you want to attack on the basis of nothing. The article I posted was about the Obama health care monstrosity. NOT ABOUT BILL O'REILLY. They have nothing to do with each other.

See? get it?

He was pointing out how O'Relly writes for WND and that if they will let just any bias fuck write for them how much can they really be trusted. Meanwhile FactCheck doesnt let just anyone write for them.
:lol2

Do YOU see? Do YOU get it? :rolleyes


Drew Zahn agreed with Factcheck.....Not WND......WND is a news website.....Drew Zahn is a writer. She doesn't speak for her entire paper.

They hired his ass there for in a way he does represent the company. This is why people get fired for acting like fuck twats when working for a company. BECAUSE ITS A REFLECTION OF THE COMPANY.


No, what I said is that people can absorb any information they wish but one must come to an independent conclusion on them.

Again. NO THATS NOT WHAT YOU SAID. What you said was...

FactCheck is absolutely unreliable for numerous reasons. First reason is that it's run by a private family (Foundation's are used by the rich for social manipulation and tax avoidance on their large sums of money),

As in people shouldnt absorb info form them. You then went on to give some crap from WND implying people should absorb info from them.

[Dimnos]

^ This quote is all fine and dandy BUT they don't mention that Obama has spent over 2 MILLION dollars fighting legal battles concealing his birth certificate.

That's 2 MILLION dollars of legal costs to hide something and who are those "experts" they are talking about and wouldn't those bloggers who added text be in jail for falsifing a legal document? Who are these experts? Why haven't they talked about the 2 million in legal fees paid to lawyers to fight cases that want to see his documentation?


http://msgboard.snopes.com/politics/graphics/birth.jpg

Yeah. He really fucking hid that one. :rolleyes Who said the guy spend $2 Mil? The guy released it himself. Why would he spend that kind of money only to release it himself. And the whole birth certificate thing is a crap shoot anyway. The guy is a legally born citizen. Get over it. Why would the lefties go through all the trouble of putting him in when they could have gotten any number of other members of their party in to "fulfill their leftist agenda"? :rolleyes

[TheCoolinator]

http://msgboard.snopes.com/politics/graphics/birth.jpg
Yeah. He really fucking hid that one. Who said the guy spend $2 Mil? The guy released it himself. Why would he spend that kind of money only to release it himself. And the whole birth certificate thing is a crap shoot anyway. The guy is a legally born citizen. Get over it. Why would the lefties go through all the trouble of putting him in when they could have gotten any number of other members of their party in to "fulfill their leftist agenda"?

Obamacrimes.com <---Website of the DEMOCRAT LEFTIST Attorney Philip J. Berg.

Obama has spend over 2 million dollars to hide his birth certificate. Some say he's Kenyan born, others say he's a naturalized citizen of Indonesia, either way he is spending massive amounts of money to conceal his documentation. No one knows who he is, he won't be questions, he won't allow it to be shown in a court of law.

Why would the "lefties" go through all this trouble? Well, it has nothing to do with "LEFT OR RIGHT", it has everything to do with Corporate, wallstreet control over the economy.

Obama is a puppet of the corporate oligarchy. He is their employee. get it?

[Dimnos]

http://tcnwag.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pLVn7RmSpzvNZyjo1WOMW3Tx5CoqNGyDYOA2lwgxzqQDlUnJ c5JT5K2XO07egGjON2PAP4fmugI9vYrAPngMiYJp5XNs9TuC9/gomer-pyle.jpg

Surprise. Surprise. Surprise. More diarrhetic bull shit.

[Dimnos]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp

What ever happened to Innocent until proven guilty? They guy says he is form Hawaii. Until someone can PROVE otherwise. Get off his dick. >:

[TheCoolinator]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp

What ever happened to Innocent until proven guilty? They guy says he is form Hawaii. Until someone can PROVE otherwise. Get off his dick. >:

That's the point of the entire matter......Democratic Attorney Philip Berg is trying to PROVE whether or not Barack Obama / Barry Sotaro is a natural born citizen.

Why doesn't Obama show his actual birth certificate? Why can't we send independent observers to look at it, feel it, put it under a microscope?

2 million dollars in fees, almost as much money as what GoldMan Sachs gave his campaign before he got into office. The same GoldmanSachs that got the lion's share of the banker bailout.

[Dimnos]

http://tcnwag.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pLVn7RmSpzvNZyjo1WOMW3Tx5CoqNGyDYOA2lwgxzqQDlUnJ c5JT5K2XO07egGjON2PAP4fmugI9vYrAPngMiYJp5XNs9TuC9/gomer-pyle.jpg

Surprise. Surprise. Surprise. More diarrhetic bull shit.

[TheCoolinator]

http://tcnwag.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pLVn7RmSpzvNZyjo1WOMW3Tx5CoqNGyDYOA2lwgxzqQDlUnJ c5JT5K2XO07egGjON2PAP4fmugI9vYrAPngMiYJp5XNs9TuC9/gomer-pyle.jpg

Surprise. Surprise. Surprise. More diarrhetic bull shit.

Not feeling that "Hope & Change" anymore? are ya? Ya, it was all bullshit. More astute people saw it coming from a mile away.

Obama = corporate puppet, warmonger, elitist, reactionary, race baiter, etc, etc, etc.

[Dimnos]

That's the point of the entire matter......Democratic Attorney Philip Berg is trying to PROVE whether or not Barack Obama / Barry Sotaro is a natural born citizen.

So your just going to assume he isnt a citizen because some retard is trying to prove some shit? :rolleyes

Why doesn't Obama show his actual birth certificate?

Umm... He did retard. :rolleyes

Why can't we send independent observers to look at it, feel it, put it under a microscope?

http://vitalrec.com/

Fucking request one then. :rolleyes

[Dimnos]

Not feeling that "Hope & Change" anymore? are ya? Ya, it was all bullshit. More astute people saw it coming from a mile away.

Obama = corporate puppet, warmonger, elitist, reactionary, race baiter, etc, etc, etc.

What are you assuming I voted for the guy or that I bought his Hope & Change crap? :lol

No. I voted for this sexy beast.

http://tcnwag.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pt7p7FNfgKQRyg8USZappYZJTiMXUL8ONDfKBdnGpzRSX-fPx1pN-K_A6MObjHHOqhRHtHmfQip0bovt78Ddkb-bkn69YluXc/Ron-Paul-Constitution-Doctor.JPG

Im only defending Obama on this issue because your trying to fault him on bull shit. You were better off attacking his health reform and not the legality of his citizenship.

[TheCoolinator]

So your just going to assume he isnt a citizen because some retard is trying to prove some shit?

No one can prove he is or not because he keeps blocking the investigations. 2 million dollars worth of road blocks that attorneys all over the country have had to climb over.

Obamacrimes.com - DEMOCRATIC Attorney Philip Berg. Read it. :rock



Umm... He did retard.

A certificate of live birth is different then an actual Birth Certificate. No one in the entire country has been able to see it, touch it, put the thing under a microscope.

No one. Read your own articles. They talk about "rumormongers" but never speak of how people aren't allowed to get near the vault copy.

[Colonel Flagg]

Coolie is in love with his own rhetoric. No one can dissuade him from what he KNOWS to be true.

I wouldn't be surprised if he's a card carrying member of this (http://www.theflatearthsociety.org) society.

"Deprogramming the masses since 1547." Just like Coolie.

And what better way to do it than on a satirical humor website forum. :rolleyes

[Dimnos]

Obamacrimes.com - DEMOCRATIC Attorney Philip Berg. Read it. :rock

What? Because the dude is a Democrat attacking another Democrat that makes him more believable? Hell if anything the fact he is an attorney should lead you to disbelieve anything he says. :lol But AGAIN, still hasnt proven shit.


A certificate of live birth is different then an actual Birth Certificate.

http://hawaii.gov/dhhl/applicants/appforms/applyhhl

Birth certificates (Certificates of Live Birth and Certifications of Live Birth) and Certificates of Hawaiian Birth are the primary documents used to determine native Hawaiian qualification.

Got any more fucking crap you want to talk out your ass? :rolleyes

[TheCoolinator]

SURPRISE! DEATH PANELS! GENOCIDE! Hope & Change! here we come!


As usual, the most dangerous parts of ObamaCare aren't receiving the scrutiny they deserve—and one of the least examined is a new commission to tell Congress how to control health spending. Democrats are quietly attempting to impose a "global budget" on Medicare, with radical implications for U.S. medicine.

Like most of Europe, the various health bills stipulate that Congress will arbitrarily decide how much to spend on health care for seniors every year—and then invest an unelected board with extraordinary powers to dictate what is covered and how it will be paid for. White House budget director Peter Orszag calls this Medicare commission "critical to our fiscal future" and "one of the most potent reforms."
.......

Worse, it makes little room for medical innovations. The commission is mandated to go after "sources of excess cost growth," meaning treatments that are too expensive or whose coverage will boost spending. If researchers find a pricey treatment for Alzheimer's in 2020, that might be banned because it would add new costs and bust the global budget. Or it might decide that "Maybe you're better off not having the surgery, but taking the painkiller," as President Obama put it in June.
.......

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703792304574504020025055040.html


Coolie is in love with his own rhetoric. No one can dissuade him from what he KNOWS to be true.

I wouldn't be surprised if he's a card carrying member of this (http://www.theflatearthsociety.org) society.

"Deprogramming the masses since 1547." Just like Coolie.

And what better way to do it than on a satirical humor website forum.

This ^

Is a perfect example of what TheLeader did with the Bill O'Reilly comment. These people can't attack what I say so they must attack me personally. They try to equate me with a joke society or personality instead of debating me on the issues I bring up.

Why do they do this? Because the people on the Television do it, monkey see, monkey do, it's mental and behavioral training for the little people.

So now everyone handles an argument like the alpha males on TV (Keith Olbermann, Sean Hannity)do by making these little immature name calling arguments where you don't actually bring any ideas to the table you just compare the other person to something or someone who is an odd ball, crazy, or universally disliked.

Like clockwork they think. It's amazing how well they are trained.

[Dimnos]

All I see is an avalanche of doublethink going on here......

I think your just covering up how long it took you to grasp something so rudimentary. Which I repeated about 40 times.

I'm not the one who made a thread based around condescending to people you just happened to walk by that day and from the amount of times you brought up your beloved "Degree" I think you have some sort of self esteem issue.

You really don't know anything do you Leader?

Oh, and does anyone else get the mental picture of a garden hose shooting out raw sewage every time TheLeader posts something? I guess it's just me.....:|

When things don't fit into your cookie cutter idea of reality you tend to start getting a little confused and revert right back to "left / right".


Do you see? Little Puppet. Do you see how they pull your strings?


Naivety strikes again!



This is all common sense. Please stop writing your little papers and begin to learn how the world really works.

Prove me wrong, o' scholar. Show us what that big "degree" can do then. Come on.

Say something else other than these infantile little snipes and grumbles from the backround. I dare you. :love


Because you would NEVER do that. :rolleyes

[The Leader]

Not feeling that "Hope & Change" anymore? are ya? Ya, it was all bullshit. More astute people saw it coming from a mile away.

Obama = corporate puppet, warmonger, elitist, reactionary, race baiter, etc, etc, etc.
:lol You're so pathetic. You don't even know who you're talking to.

What's that, a politician is a corporate tool? Holy shit, thanks for filling us in, Coolie! No one but you has a head on their shoulders to figure this out on there own so we really appreciate you being here.


Is a perfect example of what TheLeader did with the Bill O'Reilly comment. These people can't attack what I say so they must attack me personally. They try to equate me with a joke society or personality instead of debating me on the issues I bring up.

Why do they do this? Because the people on the Television do it, monkey see, monkey do, it's mental and behavioral training for the little people.

So now everyone handles an argument like the alpha males on TV (Keith Olbermann, Sean Hannity)do by making these little immature name calling arguments where you don't actually bring any ideas to the table you just compare the other person to something or someone who is an odd ball, crazy, or universally disliked.

Like clockwork they think. It's amazing how well they are trained.
How is pointing out that you're hypocrit by using a site run by Bill O'Reilly's pals while dismissing a site I used for similar, however inaccurate, reasons? You have not even tried to debate the topics. You just posted links. And I don't watch big news channels. You're doing the exact same thing that you're accusing us of, and all in one post.

[Dimnos]

http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1p3HBtfHLwxqJR1CH3sCU969XtJoYvq3jUjGuTGJIFuj7Tnm-g1vAwR8bEEbe1BVHkIHEkDXlWk0bMan1eTgTTHg/Obama.gif

[TheCoolinator]

Show me proof of Death Panels.


As usual, the most dangerous parts of ObamaCare aren't receiving the scrutiny they deserve—and one of the least examined is a new commission to tell Congress how to control health spending. Democrats are quietly attempting to impose a "global budget" on Medicare, with radical implications for U.S. medicine.

Like most of Europe, the various health bills stipulate that Congress will arbitrarily decide how much to spend on health care for seniors every year—and then invest an unelected board with extraordinary powers to dictate what is covered and how it will be paid for. White House budget director Peter Orszag calls this Medicare commission "critical to our fiscal future" and "one of the most potent reforms."
.......

Worse, it makes little room for medical innovations. The commission is mandated to go after "sources of excess cost growth," meaning treatments that are too expensive or whose coverage will boost spending. If researchers find a pricey treatment for Alzheimer's in 2020, that might be banned because it would add new costs and bust the global budget. Or it might decide that "Maybe you're better off not having the surgery, but taking the painkiller," as President Obama put it in June.
.......

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...025055040.html (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703792304574504020025055040.html)


WA BAM!

[Colonel Flagg]

Yes, post a link. That's what The Leader asked you for - proof.

We all know teh interwebs never lies.

[Tadao]

Obama was born in America.


That's proof enough for me!

[Tadao]

There is no death panel.


WA BAM!

[The Leader]

WA BAM!
How do you read that and get "Death Panels?"

[Dimnos]

So rationing of care is not Death Panels? Your lack of logic amazes me.

We didn't even need this whole "single payer option", we already have a state run medical program. Medicaid / Medicare.

By this logic we already have "death panels" whether or not they work for an insurance company the government or even a hospital. Someone is always rationing health care. :rolleyes

http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1p1MmfrS5eyynlmeQ_drjrird8PqWSdzplbPCxTLvjdR8tjmS Mp6lzId61oRXuufaKPVl6iSwnsTe9rRTWO-UgVA/lordh.jpg

[Zhukov]

Obama is a Mexican pharmaceutical corporation

WA BAM!

[kahljorn]

Like most of Europe, the various health bills stipulate that Congress will arbitrarily decide how much to spend on health care for seniors every year—and then invest an unelected board with extraordinary powers to dictate what is covered and how it will be paid for. White House budget director Peter Orszag calls this Medicare commission "critical to our fiscal future" and "one of the most potent reforms."
.......

Worse, it makes little room for medical innovations. The commission is mandated to go after "sources of excess cost growth," meaning treatments that are too expensive or whose coverage will boost spending. If researchers find a pricey treatment for Alzheimer's in 2020, that might be banned because it would add new costs and bust the global budget. Or it might decide that "Maybe you're better off not having the surgery, but taking the painkiller,"that's already how insurance is, dumbass. hey lets take a theoretical situation. Okay so like there's this guy that was turned retarded when he was 12 by an angry car. 45 years in the future he is a happy old retarded dude who pretty much looks the same. Anyway, he applies to have this new fangled brain time travel operation where they send your brain back in time and it tells the old, younger brain to go forward into the future and be a young vibrant nonretarded brain.
however this surgery costs 340817508125789123475927592594276597246524 dollars and even with inflation that is still more money than anybody in the world has (ALSO THERES THE RISK THAT THE ENTIRE WORLD COULD BE DEstROYED).

but what the fuck whats with these death panels telling poor jimmy that he can't have his brain time travels? death panel jerk offs.

So basically this is your suggestion for how obama should run healthcare and probably also the guberment:
"okay I'm president obama and here's my plan for running the country with my health care plan fully endorsed by thecoolinator of i-mockery.com/forum (check the philosophy forum guys) first of all we'll approve any treatment especially new experimental things which cost a lot, might not even work and could even have a high risk of death. That's a good deal for everybody. Oh, also there's infinite money, yes infinite money. Can i get that for myself too? Thanks. Hmm also no standards or board of directors or anything which develops ideas and strategies for the benefit of this organization; that sounds too "Death panelish" to me. Wait we're sort of devloping ideas right now aren't we? Alright guys we gotta close this death panel down."

OMG i just realized that the SENATE is already a DEATH PANEL... iu think its too late to stop them! there's death panels everywhere man what do we DOOOOOOOOOO
ugh seriously this argument makes me want to vomit.

[Zhukov]

:lol

So I was thinking of getting laser surgery to replace my glasses. I hear it's pretty good nowadays, especially since it lasts a lot longer than it once did, as in you would have to have follow up surgery after a few years. It's probably something I will eventually get around to doing, I do want it done, it's just that it costs too much for me HOLY SHIT I'M A FUCKING DEATH PANEL.

[TheCoolinator]

How do you read that and get "Death Panels?"


is a new commission to tell Congress how to control health spending.


Hence....Death Panels.

And it's a little bit different then what is usually going on. If you read the bill....which you didn't.....you would realize that there will be 500 billion dollars in CUTS to social services. That's a lot different then our usual denial of care that's literally genocide and AS I POSTED ABOVE....there is a "NEW COMMISSION" that will TELL CONGRESS how to control health spending.......I.E. DEATH PANELS.

[Zhukov]

A commission on health spending = DEATH PANEL.


Quite literally genocide. The systematic elimination of an ethnic or racial group. This is what this is.


This new commission to regulate spending on health is only interested in ethnic cleansing.

Don't you see? It's really quite obvious.

[TheCoolinator]

How do you read that and get "Death Panels?"

A commission on health spending = DEATH PANEL.


Quite literally genocide. The systematic elimination of an ethnic or racial group. This is what this is.


This new commission to regulate spending on health is only interested in ethnic cleansing.

Don't you see? It's really quite obvious.

No, please stop twisting my words around. And by genocide I'm sure you mean the US people. They are group right?

Please READ the article. You're all having trouble understanding because you haven't read the article. You just see me post anything and attack it. Grow up please.

The "new commission" will be in the business of "CUTTING COSTS". Very simple.

Are you just disagreeing with me for fun? :confused: I can't believe that people would have trouble following this.....

[Zhukov]

A commission on healthcare spending or cuts does not equal the deliberate and systematic elimination of a racial or religious group. Even if we push things to extremes and imagine that Death Panels exist solely to prevent people from getting treatment, letting people die of their own accord isn't really the most efficient genocide I've heard of.

Oh, and another brilliant piece of idiocy from you; if the Death Panels (seriously, I've heard enough of this phrase) are committing genocide on US citizens.... then... surely the Death Panels are made up of US citizens? Right? I mean, are they eliminating themselves as a national group? Really? They are destroying themselves ON PURPOSE through the use of dangerous new weapons such as letting people die of their own accord? The Death Panels are committing genocide on US citizens, which include themselves.


Do you think about things before you type them?


Genocide?



Come on.

[TheCoolinator]

A commission on healthcare spending or cuts does not equal the deliberate and systematic elimination of a racial or religious group. Even if we push things to extremes and imagine that Death Panels exist solely to prevent people from getting treatment, letting people die of their own accord isn't really the most efficient genocide I've heard of.

Oh, and another brilliant piece of idiocy from you; if the Death Panels (seriously, I've heard enough of this phrase) are committing genocide on US citizens.... then... surely the Death Panels are made up of US citizens? Right? I mean, are they eliminating themselves as a national group? Really? They are destroying themselves ON PURPOSE through the use of dangerous new weapons such as letting people die of their own accord? The Death Panels are committing genocide on US citizens, which include themselves.


Do you think about things before you type them?

So what do you believe this new commission that's meant to reign in costs will do? Give out cookies and blankets?

I've decided that you're just disagreeing with me to be silly. No one in there right mind could disagree with the facts in front of your face.

500 billion dollars in cuts to social services = death

New Commission on cuttting costs = death

More money for the insurance companies = death

But no...its all wrong....they must be doing good...they must have our best interests.....right? right? :)



The Washington commission, called the Health Technology Assessment, is manned by 11 bureaucrats, including a chiropractor and a "naturopath" who focuses on alternative, er, remedies like herbs and massage therapy. They consider the clinical effectiveness but above all the cost of medical procedures and technologies. If they decide something isn't worth the money, then Olympia won't cover it for some 750,000 Medicaid patients, public employees and prisoners.
So far, the commission has banned knee arthroscopy for osteoarthritis, discography for chronic back pain, and implantable infusion pumps for pain not related to cancer. This year, it is targeting such frivolous luxuries as knee replacements, spinal cord stimulation, a specialized autism therapy and MRIs of the abdomen, pelvis or breasts for cancer. It will also rule on routine ultrasounds for pregnancy, which have a "high" efficacy but also a "high" cost.
Currently, the commission is pushing through the most restrictive payment policy in the nation for drug-eluting cardiac stents—simply because bare metal stents are cheaper, even as they result in worse outcomes. If a patient is wheeled into the operating room with chest pains in an emergency, doctors will first have to determine if he's covered by a state plan, then the diameter of his blood vessels and his diabetic condition to decide on the appropriate stent. If they don't, Washington will not reimburse them for "inappropriate care."

From the same article.

[Colonel Flagg]

No one in there right mind could disagree with the facts in front of your face.

Its fine to disagree with others. [...]
It's OK for people to think differently.

Oh. OK - so it's "Do as I say, not as I do." I get it. ;)

[Zhukov]

Genocide?



I don't care about Death Panels or their existence.




GENOCIDE?



How is it genocide?

[TheCoolinator]

Oh. OK - so it's "Do as I say, not as I do." I get it.

More grumbles and snipes i see?

I was just expressing my opinion that no one who looks at the facts I set in front of them could possibly mistake that as not being a Death Panel.

If Zhukov still doesn't want to believe it.....it's hard for me to believe he's sincere....but I have to allow him to come to his own conclusion.

Once again,

Get over it Flagg.



I don't care about Death Panels or their existence.


Wait? You don't care about Death Panels anymore? Why.....because I just proved their existence? :lol:lol:lol:lol


The Washington commission, called the Health Technology Assessment, is manned by 11 bureaucrats, including a chiropractor and a "naturopath" who focuses on alternative, er, remedies like herbs and massage therapy. They consider the clinical effectiveness but above all the cost of medical procedures and technologies. If they decide something isn't worth the money, then Olympia won't cover it for some 750,000 Medicaid patients, public employees and prisoners.
So far, the commission has banned knee arthroscopy for osteoarthritis, discography for chronic back pain, and implantable infusion pumps for pain not related to cancer. This year, it is targeting such frivolous luxuries as knee replacements, spinal cord stimulation, a specialized autism therapy and MRIs of the abdomen, pelvis or breasts for cancer. It will also rule on routine ultrasounds for pregnancy, which have a "high" efficacy but also a "high" cost.
Currently, the commission is pushing through the most restrictive payment policy in the nation for drug-eluting cardiac stents—simply because bare metal stents are cheaper, even as they result in worse outcomes. If a patient is wheeled into the operating room with chest pains in an emergency, doctors will first have to determine if he's covered by a state plan, then the diameter of his blood vessels and his diabetic condition to decide on the appropriate stent. If they don't, Washington will not reimburse them for "inappropriate care."

From the same article.


Here it is one more time for anyone who missed it.....:posh

[Dimnos]

Coolie, what state do you live in? What House of Rep. district are you in?

[TheCoolinator]

Coolie, what state do you live in? What House of Rep. district are you in?

Why does this always have to be about me personally? Why can't we talk about the facts on the table?

Look at the ideas I bring up and say what you please about them or switch the subject to something different.

[Dimnos]

The "new commission" will be in the business of "CUTTING COSTS". Very simple.

So currently insurance companies and the big wigs running medicare/medicade are in the business of "BLOWING CASH OUT THEIR ASSES"?

I can't believe that people would have trouble following this.....

Look in the mirror you moron. :rolleyes


500 billion dollars in cuts to social services = death

New Commission on cuttting costs = death

More money for the insurance companies = death


All of this is nothing more than a slippery slope argument. It doesnt mean death. It means they arent going to be flushing money down the drain running pointless tests on some hypochondriac who only needs some tums. :rolleyes

More grumbles and snipes i see?

This is all Im hearing form you.

I was just expressing my opinion that no one who looks at the facts I set in front of them could possibly mistake that as not being a Death Panel.

What is it about people in glass houses?

If Zhukov still doesn't want to believe it.....it's hard for me to believe he's sincere....but I have to allow him to come to his own conclusion.

Zhukov is mocking you because your dumb.

Once again,

Get over it Flagg.

Once again, get over yourself. :rolleyes

Wait? You don't care about Death Panels anymore? Why.....because I just proved their existence? :lol:lol:lol:lol

What we have been REPEATEDLY telling you is that what you call a "death panel" ALREADY EXISTS. The fact that you are getting all worked up about the supposed "death panels" in the Obamacare measure is simply you BUYING INTO THE POLITICAL BULL SHIT MACHINE that your hypocrite ass has been telling everyone to avoid. God are you blind to your own crap?!


Why does this always have to be about me personally? Why can't we talk about the facts on the table?

I only ask because its apparent your going to keep shoveling your shit all the while telling people its gold. The only thing we can agree on is that we both dont like Obamacare, for different reasons or whatever. So whats the solution? To do our best to keep it out and to send a message to congress that the people dont want this. So I simply want to know who your Senators and your House Rep are. That way you can know who you need to vote to keep and who you need to vote out. Only trying to help you.

Look at the ideas I bring up and say what you please about them or switch the subject to something different.

Wait? Isnt that what we have been doing and only cry about it?

[Zhukov]

Wait? You don't care about Death Panels anymore? Why.....because I just proved their existence? :lol:lol:lol:lol


Yeah, you certainly did.

In actual fact though, I have never cared if they existed or not. I'm just pulling you up on your constant use of the word genocide.

How is a death panel committing genocide?

[Colonel Flagg]

No one in there right mind could disagree with the facts in front of your face.

Its fine to disagree with others. [...]
It's OK for people to think differently.

Oh. OK - so it's "Do as I say, not as I do." I get it. ;)

More grumbles and snipes i see?

Actually, Coolster, I was just pointing out two posts of yours that I read within a few minutes of each other. No trolling, no grumbling, just two direct quotations from your esteemed self. Showing, incidentally what kind of person you really are.

I should amend your second quotation above -

Its fine to disagree with others. Just so long as you agree with me.

Get over it Flagg.

I am over it. I'm actually having fun with it. Can you say the same thing? :lol

[TheCoolinator]

I am over it.

If you're over it why are you acting like every other person who I proved wrong online?

1. Follow me around the forum mumbling incoherently

2. Short snipes in every topic I post

3. Never challenging what I say but attacking me personally.

How old are you again?






What we have been REPEATEDLY telling you is that what you call a "death panel" ALREADY EXISTS.


Like most of Europe, the various health bills stipulate that Congress will arbitrarily decide how much to spend on health care for seniors every year—and then invest an unelected board with extraordinary powers to dictate what is covered and how it will be paid for. White House budget director Peter Orszag calls this Medicare commission "critical to our fiscal future" and "one of the most potent reforms."
.......

Worse, it makes little room for medical innovations. The commission is mandated to go after "sources of excess cost growth," meaning treatments that are too expensive or whose coverage will boost spending. If researchers find a pricey treatment for Alzheimer's in 2020, that might be banned because it would add new costs and bust the global budget. Or it might decide that "Maybe you're better off not having the surgery, but taking the painkiller,"


This^ Death panel, which you all denied existed until I showed it to you was not always here. This is a new one. Much different then the insurance companies death panels. why you may ask? because this is now mandated by the government.....with government officials leading it. See the difference?

Good.


Hope & Change!

[Dimnos]

What we have been REPEATEDLY telling you is that what you call a "death panel" ALREADY EXISTS. The fact that you are getting all worked up about the supposed "death panels" in the Obamacare measure is simply you BUYING INTO THE POLITICAL BULL SHIT MACHINE that your hypocrite ass has been telling everyone to avoid. God are you blind to your own crap?!

Man this is getting old. :sleep

[TheCoolinator]

Man this is getting old.

It doesn't matter what puppet said what about what....is it true?....that's the point....are death panels real, yes. Does Obamacare have Death panels, Yes.

What is the problem?

[Colonel Flagg]

I said I was over it, meaning over the relentless babbling on about all the things that you know to be right and why we're all blind, deaf and dumb for not seeing it too. Your response?

If you're over it why are you acting like every other person who I proved wrong online?

1. Follow me around the forum mumbling incoherently

2. Short snipes in every topic I post

3. Never challenging what I say but attacking me personally.

I haven't attacked you personally. I don't even know your real name. What I am pointing out to you (which in your view I guess is attacking) is your inconsistent arguments, citing of biased opinion pieces from reliable news outlets (they're called "columns"), fringe bloggers that support your worldview, etc.

For the record, I have responded once or twice in a rather (for me) long-winded manner about what I believe and why, and they have largely gone either unread (apparently), ridiculed (frequently) or ignored (most often) by you. This is the norm rather than the exception, and I believe many others have felt the same way.

As for sniping at you in every topic in which you post, I don't visit the gaming forum much, where you are quite active, so you're wrong again, dude.

Lastly, I guess you must be right about the "mumbling incoherently" part - I mean, you should know, right? :)

How old are you again?

Check out the calender, or my profile, if you're really interested.

[TheCoolinator]

I haven't attacked you personally. What I am pointing out to you your inconsistent arguments, citing of biased opinion pieces from reliable news outlets (they're called "columns"), fringe bloggers that support your worldview, etc.

.

Anyone else see the problem with the above statement?

Paraphrase:
"I'm not attacking you but I have to follow you around and attempt to discredit every comment you make"

Obsess much?

[Dimnos]

No

and

No

:\

[Colonel Flagg]

I didn't say that - you paraphrased. (I didn't include the grammatical error, for example)

Let's go back to talking about "Death Panels," shall we?

[Dimnos]

Lets not.

[TheCoolinator]

Lets not.

Dimnos is right,

If you've read the article I posted then the conversation is pretty much over.

[Dimnos]

The one about you being gullible choad.

[TheCoolinator]

The one about you being gullible choad.

No, The one about the Death Panels.

[Dimnos]

Right. Same same.

[TheCoolinator]

I believe the original inquiry was "Does Obamacare have Death Panels?"

Correct?

and we found out it does through my diligent research. Your Welcome.

[mew barios]

most people don't consider an unsourced opinion article to be convincing proof. especially not for something like "death panel" which was originally a criticism of something different and apparently has no real definition. i bet a lot of people make fun of you when you try to communicate your opinion entirely through copypasting alarmist blogs with varying levels of boldness and font size. is that because everyone is stupid but you? or maybe there's a simpler reason.

[The Leader]

If you're over it why are you acting like every other person who I proved wrong online?
Who are these people?

I believe the original inquiry was "Does Obamacare have Death Panels?"

Correct?

and we found out it does through my diligent research. Your Welcome.
Uh, when I pointed out that I couldn't read a paper that was referenced in an article that you posted without joining some mailing list you directed me back to the article, not the actual paper that it was referencing. If you don't understand why a peer reviewed journal or scholarly article is more credible than a blog then I don't really think that you can prove anything to anyone who is semi intelligent.

I have a serious question, are you for all of these things, the death panels, corporations running the government, etc? I'm wondering because while you post almost nothing but all of these decidedly negative viewpoints, one of your suggestions to me via pm was to get a job. You've also mentioned how you have a corporate job so I am just wondering if you support these corporations and their manipulations? I get a decidedly negative feeling from your posts but the fact that you claim to not follow the masses while suggesting people support the corporations, which I think are ruining the world, causes some confusion.

[Tadao]

OH OH! MEW IS ABOUT TO POUND HIS FIST INTO A WALL.

[TheCoolinator]

most people don't consider an unsourced opinion article to be convincing proof. especially not for something like "death panel" which was originally a criticism of something different and apparently has no real definition. i bet a lot of people make fun of you when you try to communicate your opinion entirely through copypasting alarmist blogs with varying levels of boldness and font size. is that because everyone is stupid but you? or maybe there's a simpler reason.


The Washington commission, called the Health Technology Assessment, is manned by 11 bureaucrats



White House budget director Peter Orszag ....... Medicare commission


So far, the commission has banned knee arthroscopy for osteoarthritis, discography for chronic back pain, and implantable infusion pumps for pain not related to cancer. This year, it is targeting such frivolous luxuries as knee replacements, spinal cord stimulation, a specialized autism therapy and MRIs of the abdomen, pelvis or breasts for cancer. It will also rule on routine ultrasounds for pregnancy, which have a "high" efficacy but also a "high" cost.

I can't prove this information wrong, I've tried, if you or any other person has can I would love to hear it. Until then this seems to be the real deal.

Are Obama death panels real? Yes.

[The Leader]

You also can't show us where you got the information from.

[Dimnos]

Dont you know? His ass.

[TheCoolinator]

You also can't show us where you got the information from.

Wallstreet Journal. Jump back a few pages.

Research new Health Technology Assessment and Peter Orszag. You will find it there.

[The Leader]

Why? Why can't you just post another link and why can't you answer my last serious question about your support of corporate dominance of society?

[Dimnos]

The Board of Retired Seniors Health Commission is headed by Osama Bin Ladin

Today House Republicans found the new health care reform included measures that gave unparalleled decision making authority to Genghis Khan and his general Sabutai

Man we are fucked. :(

[The Leader]

SHIT

[TheCoolinator]

Why? Why can't you just post another link and why can't you answer my last serious question about your support of corporate dominance of society?

Was that Wallstreet Journal article true?

I couldn't find anything to the contrary. I'm sorry to say it but bubble head Sarah Palin was actually right. Wow.

[The Leader]

I have a serious question, are you for all of these things, the death panels, corporations running the government, etc? I'm wondering because while you post almost nothing but all of these decidedly negative viewpoints, one of your suggestions to me via pm was to get a job. You've also mentioned how you have a corporate job so I am just wondering if you support these corporations and their manipulations? I get a decidedly negative feeling from your posts but the fact that you claim to not follow the masses while suggesting people support the corporations, which I think are ruining the world, causes some confusion.

Answer the question you stupid fascist.

[TheCoolinator]

Answer the question you stupid fascist.

I think you're getting a little bit too personal. Re-Read my posts and good luck.

[The Leader]

When I re-read your posts you come off as a hypocrit. You blame the government for even more horrible things then most people already do and then go along your merry way telling people to "get a job." You're the perfect puppet of the shadow government. You are fully aware of their operations but what do you do to stop them? Nothing. You make a little blog online and post on some forums and that is the extent of your anti-government/corporate activity.

YOU ARE ONE OF THEM.

[TheCoolinator]

When I re-read your posts you come off as a hypocrit. You blame the government for even more horrible things then most people already do and then go along your merry way telling people to "get a job." You're the perfect puppet of the shadow government. You are fully aware of their operations but what do you do to stop them? Nothing. You make a little blog online and post on some forums and that is the extent of your anti-government/corporate activity.

YOU ARE ONE OF THEM.

You see to be getting a little bit too emotional about this. You need to do more research into reality.

I would suggest you open your mind to what's really going on under the surface. Good luck.

[The Leader]

He writes using a internet connection and computer purchased with corporate blood money.

[mew barios]

i find this coolinator offensive as his method of argument is one far better suited to a machine, and for a living human to initiate it is incredibly inefficient.

here's just a basic idea of automated processes

look for a forum that a cursory search includes the word 'obama', but doesn't include the word 'obamacare'. this is a fair enough bet that it's both a politically minded forum, and one in need of further education.

look for a post with a title about health care, it doesn't matter how old it is. and open up with a reply about death panels. something generic about the government, hope and change, something about a birth certificate. it's not really important as long as it's nonspecific to whatever the conversation may have originally been.

every 2-5 replies quote the 2-3 most recent and reply with an opinion editorial or conspiracy theorists blog. you can have a large list but really just one per forum is fine. have a few other preset lines like, 'people always insult me instead of addressing my factual facts' and various phrasings of asserted victory. by adjusting the posts based on the volume of replies and certain keywords i believe it could be relatively convincing.

this could free up countless hours to expound your important ideas via other mediums. i don't particularly like the kind of work that increases the level of human suffering, but i'm sure you could find someone willing to develop this system for you.

[kahljorn]

This^ Death panel, which you all denied existed until I showed it to you was not always here. This is a new one. Much different then the insurance companies death panels. why you may ask? because this is now mandated by the government.....with government officials leading it. See the difference?I see the difference, but its not really relevant.

The Washington commission, called the Health Technology Assessment, is manned by 11 bureaucrats, including a chiropractor and a "naturopath" who focuses on alternative, er, remedies like herbs and massage therapy.Whenever i rwrite, er, professional articles to convince people of facts i always use terms like ER cause its totally a news story now FACT and probably not just somebodies opinion.

So far, the commission has banned knee arthroscopy for osteoarthritis, discography for chronic back pain, and implantable infusion pumps for pain not related to cancer. This year, it is targeting such frivolous luxuries as knee replacements, spinal cord stimulation, a specialized autism therapy and MRIs of the abdomen, pelvis or breasts for cancer. It will also rule on routine ultrasounds for pregnancy, which have a "high" efficacy but also a "high" cost.well.. shit guys.. I think I finally see where the coolinator is coming from. I mean its totally worse for these people to have absolutely no coverage then it is for them to have some. It would totally be better and much less death panelish if we just didn't let anybody have health care. Much better than somebody not getting their IMPLANTABLE PAIN PUMPS BECAUSE THEIR LEFT FINGERS HURT SometimeS. How many people really need things like IMPLANTABLE PAIN PUMPS? need them so bad that PILLS, SHOtS, IVS and every other alternative isn't good enough and its deathpanelish to refuse it?
that's like asking HOW COME ONLY CANCER PATIENTS CAN GET CHEMOTHERAPY?

most of the things you listed have alternatives or are things you do as a last resort anyway. Also, pay for your own shit? Jesus, if i go into a hospitol and tey say, "SORRY CANT SAVE YOUR LEg CAUSE YOUR INSURANCE CANT COVER IT" i might just go, "OH HEY PUT IT ON My tAB" since they can't legally refuse treatment.

Again, the COMMITEE doesn't decide whether people live or die it just makes decides if they are going to pay for it or not. Which isn't really so bad because the alternative is that people have to pay for everything.
Furthermore although the state might not cover it, other insurance companies probably will and it should be easier to get coverage from them with this bill.



Oh yea and I recall seeing something about medicaid and social services receiving cuts? Well, now that there will be nationwide medical coverage many programs which were designed to help people with medical costs will no longer be needed.

[Zhukov]

i find this coolinator offensive as his method of argument is one far better suited to a machine, and for a living human to initiate it is incredibly inefficient.

here's just a basic idea of automated processes

look for a forum that a cursory search includes the word 'obama', but doesn't include the word 'obamacare'. this is a fair enough bet that it's both a politically minded forum, and one in need of further education.

look for a post with a title about health care, it doesn't matter how old it is. and open up with a reply about death panels. something generic about the government, hope and change, something about a birth certificate. it's not really important as long as it's nonspecific to whatever the conversation may have originally been.

every 2-5 replies quote the 2-3 most recent and reply with an opinion editorial or conspiracy theorists blog. you can have a large list but really just one per forum is fine. have a few other preset lines like, 'people always insult me instead of addressing my factual facts' and various phrasings of asserted victory. by adjusting the posts based on the volume of replies and certain keywords i believe it could be relatively convincing.

this could free up countless hours to expound your important ideas via other mediums. i don't particularly like the kind of work that increases the level of human suffering, but i'm sure you could find someone willing to develop this system for you.

That's brilliant.


Also, Coolinator, how is a Death Panel committing genocide against the American people?

[TheCoolinator]

Also, Coolinator, how is a Death Panel committing genocide against the American people?

Will the Death panels be killing US Citizens? And aren't the US population a group of people?

[Zhukov]

Firstly, no, the "Death Panels" will not be killing people. By your own statement, they will be refusing care which may lead to death. Killing by proxy at a MASSIVE stretch.

Secondly, to be genocide it would mean that the "Death Panels" aim is the complete and purposeful elimination of this national group. I hope you aren't mad enough to suggest that Obama's aim in creating "Death Panels" is the elimination of the entirety of the US people.


Thirdly, the "DEATH PANELS" (I will never feel comfortable saying that) will be run by US citizens, so for it to be genocide they would have to be eliminating themselves.

Eliminating themselves as a national group by refusing themselves treatment for life threatening illnesses.


Do you have ANY idea how insane you are?


Stop saying it's genocide. If you read it somewhere then perhaps whomever said it isn't as smart as you once thought, and if you made it up yourself, try to think things through next time before you say them and defend them doggedly.

[Dimnos]

I have to agree with Kahl. The difference between the people who ration out care under Obamacare vs the ones at insurance companies is irrelevant. Hell if anything the fact it will be rationed out by the government means they will be less worried about making the company a profit. Which means your probably more likely to get covered. You see Medicare/Medicaid already exist and already have government employees who determine whether or not you get covered. Guess what. They cover people who are never going to get better. People who will never get well enough to hold down a job. People who will never be "contributing members of society". Are they left to their fate denied medical aid and coverage? No. Simply no. I still say to call it a "death panel" is a grotesque misconception.

[TheCoolinator]

they will be refusing care which may lead to death. Killing by proxy at a MASSIVE stretch.

I think you answered your own question. Even though you tried to hurdle over it with a feet of mental gymnastics.


Secondly, to be genocide it would mean that the "Death Panels" aim is the complete and purposeful elimination of this national group. I hope you aren't mad enough to suggest that Obama's aim in creating "Death Panels" is the elimination of the entirety of the US people.

I'm assuming since its going to ration the care of the US population then the US people will be dying from this.

I doubt they are going to kill everyone with the rationing but we are going to see a lot of deaths nonetheless.


Thirdly, the "DEATH PANELS" (I will never feel comfortable saying that) will be run by US citizens, so for it to be genocide they would have to be eliminating themselves.

These US citizens that are running the Healthcare Commissions (Rationing of care...Death Panels) will already be bought and paid for puppets of corporate interestes.....like every single politician in the world.

Remember,

Oligarchy:

They ration your care

They reduce your standard of living

They pass laws you have to follow

........This is for you....not them or their employees.

[The Leader]

No, it's not. Zhukov isn't American.

[Zhukov]

I doubt they are going to kill everyone with the rationing but we are going to see a lot of deaths nonetheless.


I'm ignoring every other retarded thing you said, but this.

If their aim is not to try to kill everyone of this national group (including themselves), it's not genocide.


Shut up now.

[TheCoolinator]

I'm ignoring every other retarded thing you said, but this.

If their aim is not to try to kill everyone of this national group (including themselves), it's not genocide.


Shut up now.


Once again,

The original question was "Is there really Death Panels in Obamacare" and the answer is, Yes.


I don't know why you're so hung up on this Genocide comment. Here, let me put it like this.......

The US people are a group of individuals that will be affected by the recently discovered Death panels. Meaning the American people will be allowed to die because of it. Meaning a group of individuals from a specific country will die because of the cuts in benefits.

Get it yet? Why does it have to be "everyone" to be genocide? Native Americans are still around and there was a genocide on them. Jewish people are still around and they had a genocide on them.


No, it's not. Zhukov isn't American.

They are passing similar laws in other countries as well.

[Dimnos]

COMING SOON

MORE IDIOTIC DRIBBLE!

DELIVERED BY THE DUKE OF DUNCE HIMSELF!

THECOOLINATOR!

http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1p9orD4o6pz7-D6F-Ev5fAD-2CROILuPlDeweY6GDIIqp_dOQ-Ls3G2OSmwUXCDJZTr1HdwwQbiaPItf-WGn1WLA/crazylaugh3lc.gif

[Dimnos]

ONCE AGAIN! THIS PARTY NEVER ENDS!!!!

[Dimnos]

ONCE AGAIN!!

[Zhukov]

Once again,

The original question was "Is there really Death Panels in Obamacare" and the answer is, Yes.

[QUOTE]

UHHHHHHHHH no. My original question was "why are you using the term 'genocide' when only someone with severe learning disabilities would think to use it as you have?"

[QUOTE]
The US people are a group of individuals that will be affected by the recently discovered Death panels. Meaning the American people will be allowed to die because of it. Meaning a group of individuals from a specific country will die because of the cuts in benefits.
Because there is a difference between "being allowed to die" and the deliberate and forcible elimination of this group.


Get it yet? Why does it have to be "everyone" to be genocide? Native Americans are still around and there was a genocide on them. Jews are still around and they had a genocide on them.
Had a genocide on them. Christ. Why am I discussing this? The genocide that was committed against those particular groups was not seen through to the end, obviously. Why would Obama target this national group that HE HIMSELF BELONGS TO? For it to be genocide against the US people (your words) then the entirety of that group has to be targeted. If it's not targeting people for their national heritage (or race, religion etc) then it's not genocide.

[Dimnos]

Dont forget "with the intent to wipe out completely"

[Zhukov]

They are passing similar laws in other countries as well.

Which ones? Certainly not mine. Most first world countries already have a working healthcare system.

[TheCoolinator]

UHHHHHHHHH no. My original question was "why are you using the term 'genocide'

That's your question not THE original question.


they will be refusing care which may lead to death. Killing by proxy at a MASSIVE stretch.

^ Your quote.

The US people are a group of individuals that will be affected by the recently discovered Death panels. Meaning the American people will be allowed to die because of it. Meaning a group of individuals from a specific country will die because of the cuts in benefits.

^ My quote.

This should answer your question. :sleep

Because there is a difference between "being allowed to die" and the deliberate and forcible elimination of this group.

"Allow to die"

Wouldn't that be....murder? on the US people....which would be....Genocide since it's a specific group of people?


Why would Obama target this national group that HE HIMSELF BELONGS TO? For it to be genocide against the US people (your words) then the entirety of that group has to be targeted. If it's not targeting people for their national heritage (or race, religion etc) then it's not genocide.

ummm....Politicians who work for international companies don't care who they harm in their actions. This is common sense. Did Stalin care that he committed genocide against millions of Russian people? No. Because he was an oligarch. He ruled. He wasn't a russian. He was the Leader of the russians. I'm not saying Stalin worked for any kind of corporate enterprise but his space in history is very similar to the callous nature of our present day politicians.

And I'm an American Citizen born here in the united states. My national heritage is that of the USA. I don't understand where you're going with this. It's all very strange.

If the Death Panels (which are real) kill US Citizens then that's a genocide against the US population. No different if it was a genocide against the British or Icelandic or Russian.


gen·o·cide
the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.

[The Leader]

By calling this a genocide you're saying that the goal of Obamacare is to kill all Americans.

[Dimnos]

"The deliberate and systematic extermination" is the part Zhukov is having trouble with. He never once said that the American people as a national group couldnt be the target of genocide. Just that they arent.

[The Leader]

Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.

[Zhukov]

An interesting point for everyone but Coolinator; most of what people think of as Stalin's "genocides" are not in fact genocides. Hundreds of thousands of people were imprisoned, executed, starved or relocated, but because Stalin was part of the team that made up what the UN considers "genocide", they omitted political views alongside race, nation, religion etc from the treatise...

So, while genocides against many ethnic peoples still went on in the USSR; against the Cossacks for example, most people killed were killed because they were an enemy of the state for political or economical reasons, rather than racial or religious ones. Interesting, huh?

Now, back to banging my head against a wall:


the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national group
By your imagination Death Panels will be responsible for killing people through lack of care. Murder, as you see it. US citizens will die. They wont, however, be targeted by "Death Panels" with aim of eliminating them as a national group.

This is completely absurd.

Are Death Panels rounding up US citizens wherever they find them and killing them? Are US citizens forced to leave their country as refugees because of persecution? Are your Death Panels actively intent on destroying the nation of the USA?

Are they?


ARE THEY REALLY DOING THAT?


If the Death Panels (which are real) kill US Citizens then that's a genocide against the US population.

So if some mugger kills two people in a bungled hold up, and those two people are US citizens, is that genocide against the US population? Hell, the mugger might go out and do it again, killing three more people. Again on Sunday, killing an old lady. Genocide, right? I mean, serial killers are committing genocide against the US population. Obviously.

[TheCoolinator]

"The deliberate and systematic extermination" is the part Zhukov is having trouble with. He never once said that the American people as a national group couldnt be the target of genocide. Just that they arent.

So, when the healthcare commission (Death panels) start rationing care, who will be affected by this?

If the answer will be the US population then wouldn't that be a form of Genocide, Murder, immoral behavior all done with malice of forethought?

An interesting point for everyone but Coolinator; most of what people think of as Stalin's "genocides" are not in fact genocides. Hundreds of thousands of people were imprisoned, executed, starved or relocated, but because Stalin was part of the team that made up what the UN considers "genocide", they omitted political views alongside race, nation, religion etc from the treatise...

Anyone else see a problem with this statement? ^^^^

So, while genocides against many ethnic peoples still went on in the USSR; against the Cossacks for example, most people killed were killed because they were an enemy of the state for political or economical reasons, rather than racial or religious ones.

Were they citizens of the USSR? Were they part of a national group of individuals? Thus....Genocide?

gen·o·cide
the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.



By your imagination Death Panels will be responsible for killing people through lack of care. Murder, as you see it.

Sorry, I have to stop you right there. If you allow someone to die because of lack of care....then in a court of law that would be seen as murder. Especially when you're a public servant and your job is to protect the well being of the people whom you work for. This is common knowledge.



US citizens will die. They wont, however, be targeted by "Death Panels" with aim of eliminating them as a national group.

If you target and ration US citizens health benefits.......what do you think will happen to the individual in question when they need a serious operation and or expensive medication to continue living?



Are Death Panels rounding up US citizens wherever they find them and killing them? Are US citizens forced to leave their country as refugees because of persecution? Are your Death Panels actively intent on destroying the nation of the USA?

They don't need to. They'll just deny their health benefits. No need to hunt them. If they need insulin or an operation....they'll just say "no". Simple as that.....hence why they're called DEATH PANELS. lol. Wow, you're pretty dense my friend. Sharp as a marble too. :lol:

[Colonel Flagg]

If the Death Panels (which are real) kill US Citizens then that's a genocide against the US population. No different if it was a genocide against the British or Icelandic or Russian.

gen·o·cide
the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.



I'm assuming since its going to ration the care of the US population then the US people will be dying from this.

I doubt they are going to kill everyone with the rationing but we are going to see a lot of deaths nonetheless.

[emphasis mine]

You call it genocide, but earlier admitted that it's not. Make up your mind, dude.

As for "rationing healthcare = death panels", I was on an HMO plan about 5 years ago (before anyone ever uttered that hackneyed phrase, "death panel") that rationed my family's healthcare. GODS, WE WERE SUBJECTED TO A DEATH PANEL AND NARROWLY EXCAPED GENOCIDE!!!! WHAT'S WORSE IS THAT WE NEVER EVEN KNEW IT!!!!

Coolie, you really need to read your posts for comprehension before hitting the "submit reply" button. I'm not calling you names nor am I being mean spirited. I'm making a kind and gentle suggestion that could help you from yourself.

[The Leader]

Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.
:|

[TheCoolinator]

You call it genocide, but earlier admitted that it's not. Make up your mind, dude.

I believe it's a form of genocide no matter how you twist my words. The rationing of care by this new commission will be a federally mandated death board. With immunities of course.

Rationing care against the US population = Genocide. Don't know how else to explain it to you people. :sleep


As for "rationing healthcare = death panels", I was on an HMO plan about 5 years ago (before anyone ever uttered that hackneyed phrase, "death panel") that rationed my family's healthcare.

Why didn't you take them to court? Why didn't you fight for your family? Or find another insurance plan?

See, you need to read what's going on. From the top, The new and improved government death panel WILL be in charge of deciding what tests, treatments, cures, and surgeries are allowed. If they are NOT allowed.....pay close attention now.....then your insurance...here it comes.......WONT COVER YOU. Tada! Get it? So, they'll deny you before you even need any of these medical wonders to keep on living.

Please, Read the Article. On the Death Panels and look up Peter Orzsag

[The Leader]

I believe it's a form of genocide no matter how you twist my words. The rationing of care by this new commission will be a federally mandated death board. With immunities of course.

Rationing care against the US population = Genocide. Don't know how else to explain it to you people. :sleep

You can't explain it because it is not logical. Rationing of care is not the systematic and intended extermination of Americans. The goal of Obamacare is not for everyone to die and no more people will die from it than from the previous system.

[TheCoolinator]

You can't explain it because it is not logical. Rationing of care is not the systematic and intended extermination of Americans. The goal of Obamacare is not for everyone to die and no more people will die from it than from the previous system.

So a deliberate and systematic rationing of care for US citizens through federally mandated Death boards is not genocide?

[The Leader]

No, there has to be killing of some type involved, honey.

[TheCoolinator]

No, there has to be killing of some type involved, honey.

Has there been any deaths involved in the Private run Insurance death panels? If so....do you believe there will be deaths involved in the new Obamacare death panels?

[Dimnos]

The Colonel didnt twist your words. He quoted them exactly has you wrote them.

The rationing of health care doesnt equate to genocide no matter how you slice that pie.

Hell the tuskegee experiment where they knowingly and intentionally gave syphilis to a bunch of blacks and withheld medication by tricking them into taking placebos even when it resulted in death, cant be considered genocide. :folleyes




Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.

Still waiting on an answer to this.

[The Leader]

I'm sure that there have been deaths due to lack of funds/rationing of care, and there will continue to be. This is not genocide, however, because its goal is not to kill Americans, let alone all Americans. You're just trying really hard to not be wrong.

[Dimnos]

Has there been any deaths involved in the Private run Insurance death panels? If so....do you believe there will be deaths involved in the new Obamacare death panels?

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

EVEN IF THERE ARE DEATHS INVOLVED THAT DOES NOT MEAN ITS GENOCIDE.

[The Leader]

Coolie, as Zhukov wrote before, if a serial killer kills Americans, does such a thing constitute genocide?

[Dimnos]

Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.

Still waiting...

[The Leader]

Or hey, even better, if a fireworks factory explodes and kills a bunch of people, does that mean that the fireworks industry is committing genocide against America?

[The Leader]

Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.
:\

[TheCoolinator]

Yada yada yada.

knowingly and intentionally rationing care for a specific nation group is a form of genocide. Especially when it comes from government appointed death boards.

Research Peter Orzsag. Please. Thank you.

I'm sure that there have been deaths due to lack of funds/rationing of care,and there will continue to be. .

Thank you.

[The Leader]

So anytime that there is death it's genocide? HEY GUYS ANYTIME PEOPLE DIE ITS GENOCIDE IT'S OK THERE REALLY ISN'T A REASON FOR THE TERM TO EXIST SO LETS JUST USE LIKE CRAZY

[TheCoolinator]

So anytime that there is death it's genocide?

You know that panel that's deliberately and systematically targeting US citizens health benefits?

Ya....I would say that's a form of genocide.

[The Leader]

But it's targeting their health benefits. It's not killing them with the goal of eradicating all Americans. Stop genocideing me coolie, gosh. You're so genocide.

[The Leader]

And why can't you tell us about your mother?

[Dimnos]

knowingly and intentionally rationing care for a specific nation group is a form of genocide.

No. Incorrect. Wrong. Inaccurate.

Especially when it comes from government appointed death boards.

Especially nothing. Genocide is genocide as genocide is genocide. Who is conducting and who is receiving it doesnt especially make more genocide-o-licious.


Research Peter Orzsag. Please. Thank you.

Orszag? What the fuck does he have to do with the definition of genocide? Or are you reverting back to trying to convince me that the rationing of health care is done by a "death panel" because of this guy? Either way its irrelevant and your still dumb.

Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.

Still waiting. >:

[TheCoolinator]

Orszag?


You don't know who Peter Orzsag is?

And you don't think a government panel rationing care of the US population (A Nationality) is genocide?

Ok. Fine with me.

[The Leader]

:lol HEY EVERYONE LOOK AT ME I'M COOLIE GENOCIDE GENOCIDE PAPER GENOCIDE

[The Leader]

Orszag? What the fuck does he have to do with the definition of genocide? Or are you reverting back to trying to convince me that the rationing of health care is done by a "death panel" because of this guy?
YES FROM THIS I DEDUCE THAT DIMNOS HAS NO IDEA WHO PETER ORSZAG IS OH WAIT NO, I'M JUST TOO STUPID TO READ GENOCIDE GENOCIDE GENOCIDE:x

[Dimnos]

I just wanted to make sure we were talking about the same guy. But way to dance around to point of the conversation.

Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.

Still waiting. >:

[TheCoolinator]

TheCoolinator proved me wrong and I'm very upset now. It will take me a long time to get over this. It's very serious because it happened on the internet.

I'm still very bitter and angry.


It's ok. You'll get over it in time.

[Dimnos]

Hey Leader.... The other day my son shut his finger in the door. He wanted a band-aid but because it wasnt bleeding I didnt give him one. Is that genocide? Am I on a death panel?

[TheCoolinator]

I don't know who Peter Orzsag is and don't wish to educate myself any further about that matter.

I'm sorry to hear that.

[The Leader]

I think everyone is as childish and simple minded as I am so I am going to totally ignore how I am always wrong and keep trying to act like I am awesome.
You one sad mother trucker.

[Dimnos]

The dick up my ass doesnt make me gay. Its just a suppository.

:rolleyes

[Dimnos]

Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.


Still waiting.

[The Leader]

I wonder if coolie is crying yet.

[TheCoolinator]

I find this hilarious actually.

You guys don't know what derivatives are, don't know who Peter Orzsag is, didn't know the definition of genocide, didn't know about the death panels, still don't know what caused the global depression,...

I mean, what do you guys know? TV? Sports? Video Games?

[Dimnos]

Coolie, describe in single words only the good things that come into your mind about... your mother.

???

[The Leader]

I find it hilarious that you pretend that you think that we don't know what things are.

[Dimnos]

I find i hilarious that he pretends not to be a completely retarded fuck by being a completely retarded fuck.

[TheCoolinator]

I find it hilarious that you pretend that you think that we don't know what things are.

Do we agree on there be death panels yet? :love

Peter Orzsag. <---use...google.