Poll shows that Americans are dumb
 

Forgive my condescension, I'm in a grumpy mood. :(

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald...on/6086013.htm

Posted on Sat, Jun. 14, 2003

Many believe Iraq had, used weapons
Polls say beliefs, facts in conflict

BY FRANK DAVIES
fdavies@herald.com

WASHINGTON - A third of the American public believes U.S. forces found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, according to a recent poll. And 22 percent said Iraq actually used chemical or biological weapons.

Before the war, half of those polled in a survey said Iraqis were among the 19 hijackers on Sept. 11, 2001.

But such weapons have not been found in Iraq, and were never used. Most of the Sept. 11 hijackers were from Saudi Arabia. None were Iraqis.

How could so many people be so wrong about life-and-death information that has dominated news coverage for almost two years?

These poll results startled the pollsters who conducted and analyzed the surveys.

''It's a striking finding,'' said Steve Kull, director of the Program on International Policy Attitudes at the University of Maryland, which asked the weapons questions during a May 14-18 poll of 1,256 respondents.

He added, ``Given the intensive news coverage and high levels of public attention, this level of misinformation suggests some Americans may be avoiding having an experience of cognitive dissonance.''

That is, having their beliefs conflict with the facts.

Kull added that the poll's data showed that the mistaken belief that weapons of mass destruction had been found ``is substantially greater among those who favored the war.''

SEVERAL FACTORS

Pollsters and political analysts see several reasons for the gaps between facts and beliefs: the public's short attention span on foreign news, fragmentary or conflicting media reports that lacked depth or skepticism, and White House efforts to sell war by oversimplifying the threat.

''Most people get little whiffs and fragments of news, not in any organized way,'' said Thomas Mann, a scholar at the Brookings Institution, a centrist-liberal think tank. ``And there have been a lot of conflicting reports on the weapons.''

Before the war, the U.S. media often reported as fact the assertions by the Bush administration that Iraq possessed large stockpiles of illegal weapons. CBS News in December reported how Bush officials were ``threatening war against Iraq and its weapons of mass destruction.''

During and after the war, reports of weapons discoveries were often trumpeted on front pages, while follow-up stories debunking the ''smoking gun'' reports received less attention.

''There were so many reports and claims before the war, it was easy to be confused,'' said Larry Hugick, chairman of Princeton Survey Research Associates. ``But people expected the worst from [Iraqi President] Saddam Hussein and made connections based on the administration's policy.''

Bush has described the preemptive attack on Iraq as ''one victory in the war on terror that began Sept. 11.'' Bush officials also claim that Iraq sheltered and helped al Qaeda operatives.

''The public is susceptible to manipulation, and if they hear officials saying there is a strong connection between Iraq and al Qaeda terrorists, then they think there must be a connection,'' Mann said.

''Tapping into the feelings and fears after Sept. 11 is a way to sell a policy,'' he added.

While Bush critics see an effort to mislead the public, some analysts say Bush has been following a long presidential history of framing a foreign crisis for maximum domestic benefit.

''I'm not going to defend the president, but a policy of preemptive attacks sure looks better after this country has been hit hard,'' said Sam Popkin, a polling expert at the University of California at San Diego who has advised Democratic candidates.

SUPPORT FOR WAR

Polls show strong support for Bush and the war, although 40 percent in the May survey found U.S. officials were ''misleading'' in some of their justifications for war. A majority, 55 percent, said they were not misleading.

''People supported the war for national security reasons and that shifted to humanitarian reasons when they saw evidence of Saddam's atrocities,'' said Republican strategist Frank Luntz. ``There's an assumption these weapons will be found because this guy was doing so many bad things.''

Several analysts said they are troubled by the lack of knowledge about the Sept. 11 hijackers, shown in the January survey conducted for Knight Ridder papers.

Only 17 percent correctly said that none of the hijackers were Iraqi.

''That really bothers me because it shows a lack of understanding about other countries -- that maybe many Americans don't know one Arab from another,'' Popkin said.

The survey for Knight Ridder by Princeton Survey Research Associates questioned 1,204 American adults between Jan. 3 and 6 and has a margin of error of plus or minus three percentage points.

Hugick said his analysis shows those who are misinformed are not necessarily those who have less education.

''I think a lot of people are just confused about the threats out there,'' he said.
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Come on now...
 

Kev,
I've honestly come to expect a little more depth to the stuff you post. Big deal, so they polled 1,000 people in a country of zillions. There are much better studies with regards to the idiocy of Americans out there you could have cited that would have been much more effective in my opinion.

Like, Survivor. Those folks single-handedly proved that literally millions of Americans are complete morons. Now that's thorough.

I'm sorry to not please you, GAsux, but ultimately it seems that unless I post an article entitled "America: HEY! GIMME A BREAK!", you will remain unpleased. But I accept your role as the perpetual apologist on this board. :)

Maybe I'm just a lucky guy, but it would seem that ALL of the people I know who think this way must've been included in this one poll!!! WOAH! :rolleyes

Many people I have spoken to think this way, in fact, I had to spend a LONG time the other day convincing a friend of mine that they haven't found any weapons or chemicals. A poll is a sample of our public's mindset, and the amount isn't generally what matters, but rather, how randomly they were sampled. If you can find any research that counter-acts this data, fine. Please, show me, give me hope! But the bottom line is that you have a serious case of denial if you think this isn't a widespread, national problem.

Am I?
 

Does not being AS liberal as the majority of you make me an apologist? Funny how there is little middle ground here. It's either far left, or Vince and Ronnie (speaking of which, what the hell happened to him?).

But the heart of the issue is who's fault is it? Does the poll indicate that people are misinformed because the clever and manipulative government has coerced the nations media outlets into not reporting any damning evidence against it? Because that seems to be some kind of underlying sentiment. That the government is to blame for people's ignorance of world affairs.

And yet here are all of you, who are well informed and able to find resources on a daily basis to cast doubt on the administration. So clearly it's out there. So could it be that people just suck?

Re: Come on now...
 

A sample of 1000 in a social statistic study is, by the laws of statistics, supposed to speak for several million people. That's been proven, time and again, fairly accurately and consistently. Also, there are only about 310 million here in the U.S. , give or take.

Yeah....
 

Yeah here's the thing about that. See, I figured the fact that I said "zillions" and insinuated that a pop culture television show was more accurate than a statistical poll that it would be clear that I wasn't serious. I guess I was wrong.

I wasn't honestly arguing the validity of the polls results. People ARE stupid. So what?

Re: Am I?
 

Ronnie has been going through some personal matters, he unfortunately lost his first born baby during the pregnancy.

This isn't necessarily a "left" or "right" matter, and while I appreciate your ability to be critical on all levels, it seems that sometimes you need to give the benefit of the doubt.

You kind of failed to explain why this poll, conducted in a fashion similar to many others, lacked "depth."

I think some opinions expressed in the article are trying to argue this, yes.

I however don't give the government that much credit. The Pentagon, as well as pretty much our entire Executive branch, were INCREDIBLY misleading throughout this entire war. The press ate this up and spit it out to the public.

Now, you can either blame the press for violating a sensitive moral duty to present information in a fair manner, OR, you can blame Joe citizen for being incompetent. I tend to choose the latter lately, mainly b/c of what you stated above.

The info. was out there, and while I can understand that most people rely simply on the network and cable news, I still don't feel that gives them a pass. EVEN the main network news sources have retorted that no weapons have been found, in fact, it has turned into their latest headlines. This, IMO, says something about the attention span of your average American.

Yeah, people everywhere are dumb, but a lot of polls tend to show that on average, Americans are dumberer than any other group. ;)

1) I don't agree with polls in general whether they are in my favor or not. Polls are biased, you can taint the 1,000 you ask. If you polled 1,000 people of a certain race, income level, without variety, than that 1,000 doesn't represent millions.

2) I'm an American. If people truly believe we are a dumb nation, they are either jealous or very misinformed about the country. I can say that India is dumb for letting people starve so they can worship cows and use their dung for heating, etc....but that would be my ingorant ass not understanding their culture and calling them dumb. That might be a poor example, but whether is Americans thinking other nations are "dumb" for "being behind the times" or people believing "Americans" are dumb b/c of some Americans actions, or b/c of some poll is as silly as the first.

If you say so...
 

I'm willing to bet that if you continued the same poll on a broader scale, that the numbers would stay the same.

Perhaps "lazy" is better than dumb. Or perhaps "disinterested". Use whatever wonderful term you'd like to call it. I think it's very fair to say that a majority of Americans are horribly un/ill-informed when it comes to international events.

No doubt in my mind that a poll of 1 million Americans right now would find more people knowing who the NBA champs are than who the man put in charge of Afghanistan is.

People just don't care. Call it what you want.

Re: If you say so...
 

Well, when it gets to the point where our nation is collapsing from within as in Iran at the moment and we have a revolution, people will care, or they will just stay inside b/c will and grace is on.....ya never know.

You're lucky you guys have good beer or I'd ... I'd ... I'd ... oh, I forgot the point I was trying to make. Forget it. It's not important. I'm going to the fridge for a beer. You want one?

....
 

So that's what I've been getting at all along. I think apathy is the real problem in this country, not intelligence. As a society there is very little interest in world events. We are a pretty egocentric society. If it doesn't affect us personally, we don't seem to give too much of a shit.

There are plenty of smart people out there. In fact, some of them even post here! But they seem to be the minority that actually take the initiate to invest their personal time in learning and being informed.

when the war started I had a ton of fights with people in my family about it.
One time I was discussing it with one of my sisters and she said that there had to be a good reason for us to be going because there was no way Bush would risk everything (meaning to get re-elected) for it if he wasn't positive they would find WMD. I said that he wasn't "risking everything" because once the war ended the majority of american's wouldn't give a shit anymore. The only reason anyone watched the news was for the excitement. I said they wouldn't know if we actually found them or not, and probably would just assume we did. And that he would be re-elected either way.

Well, we have yet to know for sure if he will be re-elected....
but still I WAS RIGHT

Awwww < hand wave > ... you just like being right. Me too! :)

Sure, but this poll seems pretty cut and dry. DID we find WMD in Iraq?? Yes or No.

Furthermore, I believe the article cites previous polls conducted, which indicated several other absurd trends, such as Saddam being directly behind 9/11, etc.

And as I mentioned previously, my own personal interactions with friends and strangers can back up this study, sadly.

:boohoo

Do you find it useful to revert right to sanctimonious garble while holding a discussion??

Clearly this one poll doesn't mean America is a bad place, a "dumb" place, or for that matter not a great place. America is a great place, and it's the best country on earth. That doesn't mean we can't be honest about ourselves, our flaws, our misgivings, etc.

Yes. Yes I do.

Reliable, I'm sure.

Indeed.