[KevinTheOmnivore]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Raygun

"50 million + Americans are not pushing away from the mainstream." - Kevin

Whatever! The left has been losing power election after election after election while the right has gotten stronger and stronger... WHY?!? Because the democratic party has been take over by left wing zealots and wackos. Average Americans cannot relate to your shrills and it will be years before the American people can scrape of the stink put upon us by your depraved and immoral policies of race baiting, lying, theft and redistrobution of American hard earned money, spitting on soldiers, lying about American war crimes, wishing death upon our president and the support of our nations enemies...

Alot of the shit you said above was either wrong, or just plain silly. You are the very zealot that you claim to be opposed to. You think you seem to speak for "hard working Americans," which is nonsense. You accuse the Left of "race baiting," while it was in fact the Right that pushed social/race/sex issues into the political mainstream in the 1960s and 70s, NOT the Democrats. Your party also mobilized their "base" pushing ELEVEN gay marriage ban amendments in the states (the Dems used to do the same think in urban centers with temperance issues, it worked really well to mobilize the urban, Irish-Catholic base).

Just because you work at an airport and fancy yourself "straight blue collar," or whatever crap your profile said, doesn't mean you speak for real, hard working Americans. I think plenty of them went out and voted for Senator Kerry, too.

It will at least be another 20 years before The United States will elect another liberal. And as soon as Bush's judges get through, we will truly control all three branches of govt. and THAT'S when you'll start seeing REAL change and reform that works in this country....and when that happens you may never see another democrat as president....

You have no idea what you're tal;king about. You're not a conservative, you're not even a very good American. You're a cheerleader, and you're team just won the Super Bowl. You should give up the charade. You pretend to care about "hard working Americans," but all you care about is your party winning. You don't care that working families have seen their cost of living increase, while their real wages have declined. You don't care about healthcare, or prescription costs, or anything real working families are concerned about. You only know what the RNC/Limbaugh/Fox News bullet points tell you to know. You're a droid, and a pathetic one at that.

I'll say it one more time: Over FIFTY MILLION Americans thought that the "most liberal senator eve....blah blah" was a better choice than this president. The fact that a wartime president now serves over the most ideologically divided nation since 1860 says a LOT.

""Considerably less votes are what separated you from an electoral college loss." - Kevin

What you really want to say is that Bush doesn't have a mandate....Well, that MAY be questionable...I tend to think not. But if Bush doesn't than Clinton never did either which makes your point moot....

You are a moron. Clinton didn't have a mandate, and it's you who are the master of mootery. Clinton capitulated to 75% of the Gingrich agenda. Clinton compromised, and did what he needed to do in order to get shit done....that's not how FDR ran things, that's not how Reagan operated, either. Look at some of the REAL mandates, particularly during the New Deal. FDR bullied Congress like a dictator. That's NOT how Clinton operated, so I'd appreciate it if you'd stop digging for ways to insert the man into your already weak ass arguments.

"and nobody is thinking third parties right now" - Kevin

Yes they are!!! Blacks are pissed about the election and they blame **GUESS WHO** the democratic party...Look into and you'll see.....

There will be no third party push. Trust me on this. When the "out" party is weak and takes a defeat, they tend to realign together in order to beat the majority party. Our system has gone around and around this cycle forever, jeez, just pick up a fucking book!

There WILL however be a push to retool the DNC, which is fine. It's probably necessary. But there will be no "black party" or whatever the heck you're talking about here.....

Also, you will soon see strains in the democratic party...those who want Dean to run the party and those who feel democrats must move to the right in order to swing moderate votes....If the party moves to the right, you'll see a third party arise once more on the extreme left....which means a loss in 2008...If you remain on the left, the same thing will happen in 2008 that happend this year...you lose....

In a way, you're right. However, the Democrats have only expanded their base with this election. As i said, third party activity tends to be at its highest when it's the party in power that folks become unhappy with. Greens got bigger during Clinton, Perot got started during Bush I, and Libertarians keep getting bigger, cuz they're never entirely happy with anybody. Unlike 2000, this race has mobilized and re-organized a Democratic base unlike ever before. Montana, one of the "redest" states, now has a Democratic governor. The Democrats took two state legislatures, and overall, did MUCH better at the grassroots level than they did in 2002. New party voters were mobilized by partisan and non-partisan efforts alike. Believe me, as someone who hangs out in the often dysfunctional circles of the Left, this Party is bigger and more resolute in purpose than it has been in well over a decade. They now need a clearer message, and some direction.

Furthermore, this victory could be potentially bad for the GOP. Those "strains" you mentioned will arise in two or more years, when talk of who will run in 2008 comes up. Folks like Karl Rove will want to stay in the ballgame, and undoubtedly they'll push to run some neo-con hack that will make you blush and cheer. But then you might see a real conservative, perhaps a John McCain, step up for the spot. Like I said, in-fighting and third party activity often come when one (or both) of the major parties simply lose message and get wrapped up in winning, taking power, and maintaing that power. This is the state of the modern GOP. Look for more third party growth from the Libertarians, too. On paper anyway, they are already the largest third party in the country. The Constitution Party continues to grow in certain states as well. The strain may come from the Right when real conservatives begin to get tired of Politburro Republicanism.

Unfortunatley for you, you are fresh out of Bill Cintons...and it would probably take more than another Bill Clinton to win a national election for the dems...I would say that you'd need another JFK only he'd be a republican by today's standards.....

Sometimes ignorance doesn't even deserve a response (see above comment about books).