[Zhukov]

[quote=kahljorn;645756]
No. The act of killing (with the intent to do so) can never be right. For example, in self-defense, the act of self-defense is right, the idea of being passive and letting somebody else kill you is not right (if its wrong for you to kill them, its wrong for them to kill you); Regardless of this, it is still wrong to kill that person if you acted with the intent to do so. [quote]

Hmm, you just seem to say "It's wrong to kill" without saying much else here. I think it can be right to kill if you can justify it first. So, if you can prove it's right, then it's right. You have already said that that self defense killing (if it's the last resort before your own death) is "less wrong" than letting yourself die. We don't choose the wrong or the less wrong option, it's wrong or right. It might be the lesser of two evils, but it's still the right one to choose.

If you try hard enough, you can justify almost anything. Most wars can and have been justified, does that make them all right? What counts as a "justification," exactly, anyway? Without blanket, moral statements its difficult to have any standard by which to "justify" things.

Ok, so a blanket moral statement like "less deaths are good" might be needed to justify a war. Most wars have been "justified" at the time, sure, but I would not consider most of them just though. What counts as justification? Well, if you can convince yourself truthfully, and the population, and outside observers that your course of action is the lesser evil, then that is justified. Do what you think is the right thing to do, that's all I'm saying. The vast majority of people do anyway.

Is going to war for terrorists i mean for oil i mean to spread democracy in iraq and to liberate the gentle folk dwelling therein from a cruel and heartless dictator justified or unjustified? And what is it that makes it justified or unjustified?

Going to war in Iraq was unjustified. Most people think that way. Justifying by telling lies and spin is hardly justice.

What is it that makes it justified/unjustified? Well, that depends on the circumstances. Would going to war save lives? Make people's lives better? Would horrendous acts be stopped? In the case of the Iraq war..

Oh, I'm not talking about a reason like "WMDs" or "terrorists" or that kind of justification - those are reasons.

According to what? Maybe these wars were just spearheaded by persons who followed their own morals over the law.

Sorry, according to my morals. My main point is personal morals; if you can justify it, do it. That's not a free reign to do what you want, it's a reason to make sure what you want to do is right not only by you but by the majority of others.