Go Back   I-Mockery Forum > I-Mockery Discussion Forums > Philosophy, Politics, and News
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #251  
Zhukov Zhukov is offline
Supa Soviet Missil Mastar
Zhukov's Avatar
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tasmania
Old Dec 23rd, 2010, 07:19 AM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by kahljorn View Post
Here's a definition of ESPIONAGE that i found:
KAHL: There are several definitions out there; I was going with

1. the systematic use of spies to obtain secret information, esp by governments to discover military or political secrets
2. the act or practice of spying


or

Espionage or spying involves an individual obtaining information that is considered secret or confidential without the permission of the holder of the information. Espionage is inherently clandestine, lest the legitimate holder of the information change plans or take other countermeasures once it is known that the information is in unauthorized hands.



I hate it when we whip out the dictionary to prove a point, and I just don't consider posting anonymously donated information on your website as espionage.

UGH.

The act of obtaining, delivering, transmitting, communicating, or receiving information about the national defense with an intent, or reason to believe, that the information may be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation. Espionage is a violation of 18 United States Code 792-798 and Article 106, Uniform Code o fMilitary Justice.

Dictionary of Military and Associated Terms. US Department of Defense 2005.


In this example you could argue for and against it, since Wikileaks is receiving the information (although they don't know what they are receiving) but they don't receive it with the intent to cause injury to the US or to advance any other nation. Unless you are Pentegarn and believe that he is doing it to bring about the end of mankind.

Quote:
ALSO you can't technically "STEAL" information/ideas anyway, so most of your arguments regarding it being "Stolen" are irrelevant. "Unlawful reproduction" or transmission would be more appropriate, i guess. So just replace all of those terms with stolen and it should be AOK. The only way you can really "Steal" information is if you use it first, claim it was yours and/or get the benefits.
My arguments AGAINST Assange stealing the information have always been the same; he isn't involved in obtaining it. My arguments AGAINST any one else stealing information is based in the facts that they are not outsiders hacking in to US military bases and stealing whatever Pentegarn thinks they are stealing but hasn't told us what. Neither of us were using a dictionary or the official US legal definition for 'stealing', both of us were simply using it as 'illegally obtaining'. If having classified documents leaked to you without any action on your part counts as 'stealing', and everyone in this thread uses that stance, then I guess I will change my use of "he didn't steal it" to "he didn't do any illegal actions to obtain it". Hasn't changed my stance.

Personally, I do think there are military secrets. The blue prints of your weapons, the names and families of your soldiers, other stuff, and honestly, if someone let that sort of information out then I can see why it's illegal. It's illegal to give it away, sure, but that is what we are dealing with, not someone stealing it from outside. This is what Pentegarn has asserted this whole time; be it Julian Assange himself, personally, or him encouraging or hiring others to do it for him. This is the 'stealing' and 'stolen' I am referring to. As I said, the legal terms are above me and I can concede that and it's not really a beating on my stance, since my stance is that the information has not been obtained illegally - Wikileaks did not hack computers to get it, and even though it was/is illegal for them to leak it, whomever uploaded it to wikileaks did not have to steal to get it.

For the record I'm only talking about hacking here because that is the ridiculous accusation I was dealing with - Julain Assange is a hacker thief anarchist terrorist.

PENTEGARN: Bye! Play again anytime! Thanks for going from 'kinda cool guy that I can respect' to 'wanker who can't have a discussion without getting aggressively personal'!
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #252  
kahljorn kahljorn is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NO
Old Dec 23rd, 2010, 07:24 AM       
oh alright i gues i got the ISITSTOLEN/tRANSPARENCY/IS It A CRIME ATALL stuff all mixed up.

i still think its possible that he encourages people to leak pee on him, though.
__________________
NEVER
Reply With Quote
  #253  
Zhukov Zhukov is offline
Supa Soviet Missil Mastar
Zhukov's Avatar
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tasmania
Old Dec 23rd, 2010, 07:55 AM       
R Kelly shows support to Julian Assange: LINK
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #254  
Pentegarn Pentegarn is offline
Clap if you love Dynamo
Pentegarn's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: In a dystopian future
Old Dec 23rd, 2010, 03:25 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhukov View Post
I hate it when we whip out the dictionary to prove a point, and I just don't consider posting anonymously donated information on your website as espionage.
So you hate it when someone posts something factual that is contrary to your views?

I see....

PS Thanks from going from 'guy I barely noticed' to 'douchebag who can dish out insults but gets pissy when he has to take them'
Reply With Quote
  #255  
Tadao Tadao is offline
☆☆☆☆☆
Tadao's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2002
Old Dec 23rd, 2010, 06:06 PM       
Reply With Quote
  #256  
MLE MLE is offline
CHIEF OF POLICE
MLE's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Nice Chinese Restaurant
Old Dec 23rd, 2010, 07:48 PM       
Zhuk's got you beat out in senority, you know. Also, you started the name calling, and he didn't stoop to that level and continued to attack your arguments instead of you.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #257  
Tadao Tadao is offline
☆☆☆☆☆
Tadao's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2002
Old Dec 23rd, 2010, 07:59 PM       
GET BACK IN THE KITCHEN
Reply With Quote
  #258  
Tadao Tadao is offline
☆☆☆☆☆
Tadao's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2002
Old Dec 23rd, 2010, 08:01 PM       
I have you beat in seniority, age, dominant sex also I have never actually been removed as mod of this forum. So shut it MLE and bake me a sweater.
Reply With Quote
  #259  
kahljorn kahljorn is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NO
Old Dec 24th, 2010, 04:14 AM       
wanting to make love to tadao ruins your chances of making love with tadao
__________________
NEVER
Reply With Quote
  #260  
executioneer executioneer is offline
OH GOD
executioneer's Avatar
Join Date: Oct 2001
Old Dec 24th, 2010, 04:22 AM       
yeah tadao is **RAPES ONLY**
__________________
[COLOR=purple][COLOR=Magenta]SHAME ON A [COLOR=Pink]NIGGA WHO TRY TO RUN [/COLOR][URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVGI6mhfJyA"]GAME[/URL] ON A NIGGA[/COLOR]
[/COLOR]
Reply With Quote
  #261  
Pentegarn Pentegarn is offline
Clap if you love Dynamo
Pentegarn's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: In a dystopian future
Old Dec 24th, 2010, 05:03 AM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by MLE View Post
Zhuk's got you beat out in senority, you know. Also, you started the name calling, and he didn't stoop to that level and continued to attack your arguments instead of you.
First off, I don't know what "senority" or even seniority for that matter, would have to do with this. Only seems to matter to people like you though

Second off, he threw the first insult when he said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by zukhov
So you ARE saying that gassing Kurds and torturing civilians should have been kept classified?
which I never actually said, and he knew I never actually said, he only posted that to as you so poetically put it, 'stoop to that level' first. And to make me look hateful to distract from what I was trying to say.

I get it MLE, you dislike me personally, I also don't give a crap. That said, the least you can do is not make up events to push that agenda along. Try to stick to things that actually happened mmmkay?
Reply With Quote
  #262  
MLE MLE is offline
CHIEF OF POLICE
MLE's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Nice Chinese Restaurant
Old Dec 24th, 2010, 08:50 AM       
Oh I never even slightly disliked you until reading this thread. And I still don't dislike you personally. I just don't understand your political views, despite your continued wordy efforts to show them off to everyone.

You've got to stop assuming people hate you when they put down your arguments. You'll never be on the debate team that way.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #263  
Zhukov Zhukov is offline
Supa Soviet Missil Mastar
Zhukov's Avatar
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tasmania
Old Dec 24th, 2010, 09:30 AM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pentegarn

Second off, he threw the first insult when he said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhukov
So you ARE saying that gassing Kurds and torturing civilians should have been kept classified?
That's a question, not an insult. You're just trying to cover up the fact that you got really pissed off really easily... as soon as you were asked to back up your accusations and explain your views.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #264  
Tadao Tadao is offline
☆☆☆☆☆
Tadao's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2002
Old Aug 16th, 2012, 12:23 PM       
I think it's awesome how shitty the wiki leaks guy life is now.

So now he's in Ecuador? Is that one of the "good" countries that doesn't abuse it's citizens?
Reply With Quote
  #265  
kahljorn kahljorn is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NO
Old Aug 16th, 2012, 02:35 PM       
is this just the world powers trying to get back at him for revealing the truth?
__________________
NEVER
Reply With Quote
  #266  
Tadao Tadao is offline
☆☆☆☆☆
Tadao's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2002
Old Aug 16th, 2012, 04:00 PM       
I think it's the world powers getting back at him for trying to extort money from them.
Reply With Quote
  #267  
Colonel Flagg Colonel Flagg is offline
after enough bourbon ...
Colonel Flagg's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Old Aug 16th, 2012, 10:02 PM       
I think his 15 minutes are up.
__________________
The future is fun,
The future is fair.
You may already have won!
You may already be there.
Reply With Quote
  #268  
Zhukov Zhukov is offline
Supa Soviet Missil Mastar
Zhukov's Avatar
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tasmania
Old Aug 22nd, 2012, 12:03 PM       
Can't help but think it would get wikileaks et al a lot of fame points if he was extradited to Sweden then the US, and then sentenced to death.

I'm sure he doesn't want to die though.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #269  
Tadao Tadao is offline
☆☆☆☆☆
Tadao's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2002
Old Aug 22nd, 2012, 12:22 PM       
I'm surprised we can't buy him off of Ecuador.
Reply With Quote
  #270  
kahljorn kahljorn is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NO
Old Aug 23rd, 2012, 03:13 AM       
ecuador sounds like a really delicious place

i really just imagine the wikileaks guy living it up eating eclairs everyday and im kinda jealous
__________________
NEVER
Reply With Quote
  #271  
Tadao Tadao is offline
☆☆☆☆☆
Tadao's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2002
Old Aug 23rd, 2012, 11:31 AM       
I guess he's in London stuck inside the Ecuadorian embassy.
Reply With Quote
  #272  
kahljorn kahljorn is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NO
Old Aug 23rd, 2012, 01:02 PM       
how the hell did he end up getting political asylum from equador of all fucking places

is that like the political equivalent of me being so desperate for a job that i applied at fast food places?
__________________
NEVER
Reply With Quote
  #273  
Zhukov Zhukov is offline
Supa Soviet Missil Mastar
Zhukov's Avatar
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tasmania
Old Aug 24th, 2012, 03:04 AM       
__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

   


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:54 PM.


© 2008 I-Mockery.com
Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.