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  #51  
90's Child 90's Child is offline
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Old May 6th, 2009, 02:08 PM       
Well, actually the main goal of my editing is to do exactly what you said and toss out the annoyingly flowery prose while replacing it with terse but still descriptive prose. I also do agree with your point about the first paragraph, and I will do a complete overhaul to make it say more with less like you say I should. However, I ahve a problem with editing my transformation
sequence(s) (When I edited my first post to place a revised version of Chapter 1 in there, I added a new sequence where he transforms partway to replace an unnecessary exposition paragraph. What do you think of it?)). You see, I kinda think that it needs that detail to help the reader understand how horrible the experience is for the character (Under the rule to show, don't tell) and to get that "American Werewolf in London/body-horror" feel to the transformations. Am I erroneous in my judgement?

Also, I have a dream sequence cooking up for Chapter 4, and I was wondering if you could check and see if it's any better at being less annoyingly flowery. Here it is:

Quote:
He was at the edge of the forest, the same as he had seen in his dreams for many months now. But something was different. It seemed a little bit brighter, a little bit larger, a little bit warmer, and a little windier. And he too had changed. For his form was not human, but that of a wolf, gigantic and towering, with no human features to speak of. He heard a strange call, a powerful call, the kind of call that goes all the way into the deepest recesses of your mind, the parts that have existed long before the dawn of man. He followed it, through the bushes, through the trees, through the rivers and over the rocks until he found its source. As he stepped into the clearing, he saw something amazing. It was a wolf, a gigantic one at that, about the size of a tractor trailer, with a body whose sinews were like steel. Its fur was dappled in grey and black and silver and gold, and it’s eyes fierce and knowing, the only flaw on the magnificent beast’s composition being a large sliver knife embedded in his left flank. And it was howling at him. As the moonlight flowed over them both, it turned its head to him, and motioned it over to a path that appeared out of nowhere, a path that ran up and towards the moon hanging brightly in the sky. The wolf suddenly bolted into a run towards the path, and somehow Lou knew that he wanted him to follow. He ran towards the path, legs gracefully striding as though he were flying, eyes locked onto the wolf ahead. The wolf was far ahead, but he kept striding forward and slowly he began to catch up with the beautiful creature. As he dashed forward, hearing the wolf’s head, it gave him a look, a look that said “Good job kid, but it’s not over yet”. As they ran together, the moon in front of them grew greater and greater in size as they neared it. As the moon hung right in front of them, oh so very close to their touch, there stood an immense cliff. They ran toward it just the same, paws padding along the ground faster and faster, they jumped and…


What do you think of it?
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  #52  
Tadao Tadao is offline
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Old May 6th, 2009, 02:27 PM       
I think the point I'm trying to hit on is, less redundancy. There is nothing wrong with descriptive writing, but it is very hard for the writer to know when the reader gets the point already. This one isn't so bad at all if you keep in mind Kitsas TLDR rule. Don't be afraid of shorter paragraphs. It helps people digest the words.

He was at the edge of the forest, the same as he had seen in his dreams for many months now. But something was different. It seemed a little bit brighter, a little bit larger, a little bit warmer, and a little windier. And he too had changed. For his form was not human, but that of a wolf, gigantic and towering, with no human features to speak of.

He heard a strange call, a powerful call, the kind of call that goes all the way into the deepest recesses of your mind, the parts that have existed long before the dawn of man. He followed it, through the bushes, through the trees, through the rivers and over the rocks until he found its source. As he stepped into the clearing, he saw something amazing. It was a wolf, a gigantic one at that, about the size of a tractor trailer, with a body whose sinews were like steel. Its fur was dappled in grey and black and silver and gold, and it’s eyes fierce and knowing, the only flaw on the magnificent beast’s composition being a large sliver knife embedded in his left flank. And it was howling at him.

As the moonlight flowed over them both, it turned its head to him, and motioned it over to a path that appeared out of nowhere, a path that ran up and towards the moon hanging brightly in the sky.

The wolf suddenly bolted into a run towards the path, and somehow Lou knew that he wanted him to follow. He ran towards the path, legs gracefully striding as though he were flying, eyes locked onto the wolf ahead. The wolf was far ahead, but he kept striding forward and slowly he began to catch up with the beautiful creature. As he dashed forward, hearing the wolf’s head, it gave him a look, a look that said “Good job kid, but it’s not over yet”. As they ran together, the moon in front of them grew greater and greater in size as they neared it.

As the moon hung right in front of them, oh so very close to their touch, there stood an immense cliff. They ran toward it just the same, paws padding along the ground faster and faster, they jumped and…
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  #53  
kahljorn kahljorn is offline
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Old May 6th, 2009, 02:58 PM       
maybe yo u should try i dont know reading a book or two that doesn't suck before you start trying to write.

JUST A SUGGESTION.
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  #54  
90's Child 90's Child is offline
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Old May 7th, 2009, 12:41 AM       
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Originally Posted by Tadao View Post
I think the point I'm trying to hit on is, less redundancy. There is nothing wrong with descriptive writing, but it is very hard for the writer to know when the reader gets the point already. This one isn't so bad at all if you keep in mind Kitsas TLDR rule. Don't be afraid of shorter paragraphs. It helps people digest the words.

He was at the edge of the forest, the same as he had seen in his dreams for many months now. But something was different. It seemed a little bit brighter, a little bit larger, a little bit warmer, and a little windier. And he too had changed. For his form was not human, but that of a wolf, gigantic and towering, with no human features to speak of.

He heard a strange call, a powerful call, the kind of call that goes all the way into the deepest recesses of your mind, the parts that have existed long before the dawn of man. He followed it, through the bushes, through the trees, through the rivers and over the rocks until he found its source. As he stepped into the clearing, he saw something amazing. It was a wolf, a gigantic one at that, about the size of a tractor trailer, with a body whose sinews were like steel. Its fur was dappled in grey and black and silver and gold, and it’s eyes fierce and knowing, the only flaw on the magnificent beast’s composition being a large sliver knife embedded in his left flank. And it was howling at him.

As the moonlight flowed over them both, it turned its head to him, and motioned it over to a path that appeared out of nowhere, a path that ran up and towards the moon hanging brightly in the sky.

The wolf suddenly bolted into a run towards the path, and somehow Lou knew that he wanted him to follow. He ran towards the path, legs gracefully striding as though he were flying, eyes locked onto the wolf ahead. The wolf was far ahead, but he kept striding forward and slowly he began to catch up with the beautiful creature. As he dashed forward, hearing the wolf’s head, it gave him a look, a look that said “Good job kid, but it’s not over yet”. As they ran together, the moon in front of them grew greater and greater in size as they neared it.

As the moon hung right in front of them, oh so very close to their touch, there stood an immense cliff. They ran toward it just the same, paws padding along the ground faster and faster, they jumped and…
Thanks. By the way, have you ever considered trying to become an editor or a creative writing teacher. Because, I must say, you certainly have the skills at constructive criticism to do so.

And also, I just re-wrote that first dream sequence, and I just wanted to show it to you. Here it is:
Quote:
It was a beautiful night in the forest, trees towering towards the sky and a full moon hanging in the air. The boy was wearing nothing, running on hands and feet, eyes aglow with the call of the hunt, following a scent on the wind. He heard the rustle of leaves and hid as a deer stepped into the clearing. His body tensed, every muscle prepared to slash into the deer’s hide and taste of its sweet, sweet flesh. He jumped up, lunged and…
Quote:
He woke up.
So, what do ya think?

Also, what's your opinion on the transformation sequences? Are they any good, or too redundant?

Last edited by 90's Child : May 7th, 2009 at 09:36 AM.
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  #55  
kahljorn kahljorn is offline
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Old May 7th, 2009, 12:55 AM       
DO WOLVES WITH KNIVES IN THEIR FLANKS RUN REALLY FAST?

CANT YOU LIKE DRAW US INTO HIS FEELINGS AND WHATS GOING ON? WHAT THE HELLS GOING ON?

BASICALLY WHAT IM READING IS THIS:
THE GUYS A WOLF AND WOLVES SEE FORESTS AS WARM AND WIDE.
HE HEARD A "CALL" THAT DOES THINGS TO HIM
HE FOLLOWS IT AND FINDS WOLF-THAT-RUNS-WITH-KNIVES-IN-LEG (HIS NATIVE AMERICAN NAME I ASSUME)
HE FOLLOWED THE WOLF WHO MAKES EXPRESSIONS AND THE FIRST WOLF UNDERSTANDS HIM AS THOUGH HE WERE SOME GUYS FATHER.

IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE BOOK THERES A DREAM THAT HE WAKES UP FROM.

ARE THOSE THE MESSAGES YOU WANT TO BE SENDING TO PEOPLE?

HOPEFULLY IM NOT CONTRADICTING TADAO AND MAKING THIS CONFUSING FOR YOU.
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  #56  
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Old May 7th, 2009, 01:33 AM       
GIVE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!
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That was very funny. Well done.
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  #57  
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Old May 7th, 2009, 01:56 AM       
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Originally Posted by 90's Child View Post
Thanks. By the way, have you ever considered trying to become an editor or a creative writing teacher. Because, I must say, you certainly have the skills at constructive criticism to do so.

And also, I just re-wrote that first dream sequence, and I just wanted to show it to you. Here it is:


So, what do ya think?

Also, what's your opinion on the transformation sequences? Are they any good, or too redundant?
I hate people too much to sit in a room with them for too long.

The re-write is good, You have room to flesh it out a little more if you wanted but as far as openig go, the hardest part is for a read to open at page one and get orientated. I would keep it as it is. That is the first paragraph in the first chapter right? Once the story starts rolling is when you can start rambling more.

Paste the transformation paragraph for me, I didn't read most of it because it hurt too much
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  #58  
Kitsa Kitsa is offline
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Old May 8th, 2009, 11:50 AM       
I think another place where you might be going wrong is that you're taking yourself wayyyyyy too seriously.
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Old May 10th, 2009, 03:50 PM       
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Originally Posted by Tadao View Post
I hate people too much to sit in a room with them for too long.
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The re-write is good, You have room to flesh it out a little more if you wanted but as far as openig go, the hardest part is for a read to open at page one and get orientated. I would keep it as it is. That is the first paragraph in the first chapter right? Once the story starts rolling is when you can start rambling more.

Paste the transformation paragraph for me, I didn't read most of it because it hurt too much


Well, there are actually two of them, and I'll post both of them for you right here.

Quote:
“Oh dear lord what is wrong with me?” That is what Lou thought as he stood in front of the bathroom mirror. He felt a lurch in his stomach as it started to happen again. What “ït” was he did not know, but it was horrible, that much he knew. Everything in his body was pulsating, his body erupting in brief, intense bursts of pain. His skin was stretching, his muscles were stretching, and even his bones were stretching. He couldn’t let them see him like this, anyone, he couldn’t tell them at all. Not Cell, not Clarisse, no-one could know about what degeneration was happening to him. That is what he thought as he scrabbled into a stall to keep people from seeing him. His skin burnt as shocks of something erupted in patches and his breathing became harder and harder as his body warped. His green eyes dilated and drips and drabs of blood fell from his fingertips as something barely poked out from underneath them. How long would he be able to keep this charade of wellness up, weeks? Months? Years? And what, what in gods name would be the end result? But then, it all went away. The pulsation, the pain, the changing, everything stopped. But Lou knew it wouldn’t be for long.

A bit of explaination for this first sequence is in order. I got the idea fro mthis werewolf forum I belong to (long story), and one guy mentioned how a werewolf might change partially several times in the weeks before the full transformation at the full moon. And I thought, "Oh man, wouldn't that be incredibly horrifying if that was happening to you and you had no idea why?". So I added that concept to my story'. Whether I succeeded in doing it well is up to you.
Quote:
It was horrific. Slowly, something terrible started happen to him. What had occured before was merely a prelude, a quiet introduction to a grotesque song of flesh and blood. He tried to scream, but he couldn’t. The pain was too much, all Lou could do was curl up into a little ball in a futile effort to stop this transformation, or at least quiet his body’s screams of torment, as Cell looked on in horror. All that could be heard was the sound of bones clacking and snapping against each other and the quiet sobbing of Louis. Cell could see the fur growing like a wildfire blazing out from his skin, feeling as if a wave of needles were pushing out of his body, covering everything. His skin was being stretched like as the bones extended against it to accommodate their new form while the skin tried to catch up as shudders of pain wracked through his frame. Cell could see the beginnings of claws pushing out of his fingertips, drawing out small spurts of blood as they pushed themselves out of the fingernails. Cell could see his muscles swelling against his bathrobe, making it tighter, tighter, until it gave way to the stress and ripped like a tissue to expose the thick coat of fur slowly growing on his skin. Jutting rows of sharp teeth pushed their way out of his mouth, although now it was more of a muzzle, as it slowly elongated while he was trying to scream. His ears slowly pushed, jutted out and moved up his head. The worst part of it though was the fear in Lou’s face. Cell could see that Lou was scared, having no idea what was going on and horrified at what was happening to him. He was weeping bitter tears as his body warped and twisted, futilely attempting to scream. Cell could see him vaguely mouth the words “Help me.” as the atrocious change reached it’s climax.
So Tadao, how exactly might I make those sequences better and more impactful for the reader?

And by the way Kitsa, how might I fix the problem of me taking myself way too seriously?
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Kitsa Kitsa is offline
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Old May 10th, 2009, 05:44 PM       
http://blogs.psychologytoday.com/blo...s-people-skill

If that doesn't help, I don't know what more I can do :/
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Old May 10th, 2009, 08:47 PM       
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"Oh man, wouldn't that be incredibly furry if that was happening to you and you had no idea why?".


MORE LIKE WOULDN'T THAT BE INCREDIBLY RETARDED.
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Old May 11th, 2009, 12:31 AM       
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http://blogs.psychologytoday.com/blo...s-people-skill

If that doesn't help, I don't know what more I can do :/
Good point. To be quite frank, I really do not consider myself a good writer, and I don't really hold my writing to that much esteem. I'm just some young idiot trying to become one, like a sad little caterpillar trying to become a butterfly. But sadly I am only a mellodramatic moth. And yet I move onward.
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[/size][/font][/color]

MORE LIKE WOULDN'T THAT BE INCREDIBLY RETARDED.
Please, please, please die in fire. I mean, you are one of the most horrible gentlemen (And I use that term loosely) that I have ever met. I mean, in criticising my work Tadao at least tries to help me improve, but you, you're just a dick. And I'm not alone in my opinion. When I mentioned your criticism to ROG, he said not to listen to you because you are an asshole. And so, fly away like a pretty birdie, fly away straight into an airplane turbine!

Seriously, is it possible to ban someone for just being an asshole? Because, if so, I think that Misdemonar fits the criteria for it.

Oh and by the way, despite the fact that I like werewolves I AM NOT A FUCKING FURRY!
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Old May 11th, 2009, 12:47 AM       
OH GEE ITS THE INTERNET PAL
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  #64  
Tadao Tadao is offline
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Old May 11th, 2009, 01:55 PM       
SCAM! IT'S THE COPPERS!
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  #65  
Kitsa Kitsa is offline
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Old May 12th, 2009, 08:31 AM       
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maybe yo u should try i dont know reading a book or two that doesn't suck before you start trying to write.

JUST A SUGGESTION.
Kahl has an excellent point. Reading well-written books gives you an innate feel for what "sounds right" and what doesn't.
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Old May 12th, 2009, 05:48 PM       
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Please, please, please die in fire. I mean, you are one of the most horrible gentlemen (And I use that term loosely) that I have ever met. I mean, in criticising my work Tadao at least tries to help me improve, but you, you're just a dick. And I'm not alone in my opinion. When I mentioned your criticism to ROG, he said not to listen to you because you are an asshole. And so, fly away like a pretty birdie, fly away straight into an airplane turbine!

Seriously, is it possible to ban someone for just being an asshole? Because, if so, I think that Misdemonar fits the criteria for it.
So just because someone was mean to you on the internet they deserve a slow and painful death? What a fascist. We don't like fascists around here Johnathan Wojcik!
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  #67  
Tadao Tadao is offline
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Old May 12th, 2009, 05:54 PM       
I expected a very descriptive burning of human flesh.
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Old May 14th, 2009, 05:55 PM       
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So just because someone was mean to you on the internet they deserve a slow and painful death? What a fascist. We don't like fascists around here Johnathan Wojcik!
Right. I was overreacting a bit. And by a bit I mean a horribleload.

Anyway, Tadao, what did you think of the transformation sequences? God I am bad about purple prose.
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Old May 14th, 2009, 11:02 PM       
I think you should stop using the term 'purple prose'.
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Old May 14th, 2009, 11:32 PM       
Purple prose of the languid penis.
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  #71  
Tadao Tadao is offline
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Old May 14th, 2009, 11:37 PM       
I think there is nothing more I can do for you. Yeah I can criticize your writing forever, but that won't accomplish anything. Just have fun and practice short stories. I've only improved by writing, not by asking.
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Old May 15th, 2009, 06:05 AM       
FOR ROMANCE NOVEL MATERIAL THIS IS MEDIOCRE ENOUGH TO PASS .
MAYBE

YOU NEED MORE WEREWOLF RAPE/SEDUCTION SCENES
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  #73  
Kitsa Kitsa is offline
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Old May 16th, 2009, 07:09 PM       
Also, and this is just my personal opinion...

Starting a sentence with the word "for" is one of the most irritating and stilted practices I see popping up in this kind of writing. I cringe when I see it.
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  #74  
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Old May 18th, 2009, 07:25 PM       
USE A SEMICOLON
SEMICOLONS CURE EVERYthing
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Old May 19th, 2009, 02:28 AM       
I AM IN SCHOOL FOR WRITING AND YOUR "STYLE" OF WRITING IS WHAT WE LIKE TO CALL "SHIT."

PLEASE GIVE UP FOREVER.
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That was very funny. Well done.
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