Anti-War protester 0WN3D by Iraqi citizen

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Here Vince, I'll help ya!!!

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

washingtonpost.com
Castro Defends Crackdown on Dissenters


By ANITA SNOW
The Associated Press
Saturday, April 12, 2003; 8:16 PM


HAVANA - President Fidel Castro is defending his crackdown on dissent, shrugging off international criticism and vowing to defend Cuba against destabilizing moves by the United States.

"We are now immersed in a battle against provocations that are trying to move us toward conflict and military aggression by the United States," Castro said.

He did not directly refer to Friday's execution of three men convicted of hijacking a ferry to get to the United States, in a Friday night speech broadcast on state television. Nor did he mention the lengthy sentences given 75 dissidents convicted of helping U.S. diplomats undermine Cuba's socialist system.

Though both measures were roundly condemned by world governments and human rights groups, the communist leader made it clear that he considers his country to be under U.S. attack and that he will do whatever it takes to ensure his system remains intact.

"We have been defending ourselves for 44 years and have always been willing to fight until the end," Castro said. "If someday they make us disappear from the map, we will die with the greatest dignity in the world."

Some longtime Cuba observers believe Castro is alarmed by the U.S. government's military action in Iraq and worries his country could be next.

"I think that the Cubans have looked at what is happening in Iraq and have concluded that the United States will not be restrained by international law and international institutions," said Cuba specialist Wayne Smith, who was the top U.S. diplomat in Havana during former President Jimmy Carter's administration.

Smith said he considered such a strike unlikely but "the Cubans still need international support from the Europeans, from Canada" and what they are doing is "only shooting themselves in the foot."

The Cuban government's harsh measures began March 18 - the eve of the launch of the war on Iraq. That night, a statement read on state television announced that a roundup of "mercenaries" was underway.

Over the following three weeks, authorities arrested, tried and sentenced 75 of its most vocal critics to terms ranging from 6 to 28 years.

Authorities accused the independent journalists, opposition party leaders, human rights advocates and pro-democracy activists of receiving money from and working with U.S. diplomats to harm Cuba's economic and political systems - charges that the dissidents and Americans deny.

The crackdown came amid a rash of successful hijackings of planes and a ferry to the United States, which Cuba blames on U.S. policies that it says encourage illegal migration.

On Friday, a firing squad executed three men arrested in the unsuccessful armed hijacking of a passenger ferry on April 2. Four others were sentenced to life in prison.


© 2003 The Associated Press

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Hi Vince!!

[The_Rorschach]

Hi Vince!!

[mburbank]

HEY! I JUST REALIZED YOU NEVER POSTED THAT SUBMARINE LETTER!

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Howdy, Vince!

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Come on Vince, show us how smart you are.....

[The_voice_of_reason]

zeb must be doing some in depth reasearch. i suggest we all mock him in the other threads...i guess he kinda mocks himself. but anyway mocking him should arouse his id enough that his primal male instincts need justification in his genetic superiority, that will cause some of the most heart felt blabbery ever.

[KevinTheOmnivore]

We've grown tired of shooting fish in a bucket, but you should be careful, next target may be you. :P

[HitlerWasReich]

Cubans in America talk of Cuba as the worst place on earth, yet they have a fantastic health care system and practically zero poverty

http://www.csuchico.edu/pub/inside/a...6/03.cuba.html
a professors account of Cuba's child and educational systems, notice the constant theme of poverty. Still, it is very pro-cuban so one wonders what a more skeptical eye could have seen in the average Cuban's "happiness". His end claim about racism is interesting regarding this:
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/arti...2/170022.shtml

I think that the Cubans have looked at what is happening in Iraq and have concluded that the United States will not be restrained by international law and international institutions," said Cuba specialist Wayne Smith, who was the top U.S. diplomat in Havana during former President Jimmy Carter's administration.

Carter's administration had some of the worst foreign policies of any president. Castro is using the war as an excuse to clean house. The U.S. will not attack Cuba, Castro is smart enough to realize this and is using his "battle against provocations" as an excuse to murder opponents. No one believes that the current war against terrorism could be applied to Cuba, they don't have oil after all.

The point in the original radio piece was this "How will leaving Saddam in power promote peace?" It won't. The current statistcis even from left biased groups are what 10.000? WHERE'S MY 500,000? I demand more dead brown skinned babies. This war so far has killed far less than Saddam has in the past or would have in the future. Whether we can win the peace remains to be seen, but I hardly consider people who promised me 100's of thousands dead as prophetic or even competent. The main complaint seems to be about over-turning International Institutions. Organizations mired in corruption, slow acting bureaucracies, and idealogical splits. Is Libya fit to give advice on human rights? How many other nations pursue UN resolutions to declare war? How many unelected dictatorships are members of the UN?

[KevinTheOmnivore]

The poverty is ubiquitous, said Spear, and affects people, infrastructure, and institutions. Everywhere there are buildings, streets, and plazas in need of repair.

Show me an inner-city school in our American paradise that doesn't need the same thing.

According to the CIA World Fact book (http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/...k/geos/cu.html), Cuba is quite similar to us in their rate of literacy, their level of infant mortality, as well as their life expectancy at birth.

Furthermore, according to the World Health Organization, compared to the U.S., who according to 1995 numbers averaged 279 physicians per every 100,000 people, Cuba (according to 1998 figures) averaged roughly 530 physicians for every 100,00 people, and that's with a considerably smaller population that that of the U.S.
http://www3.who.int/whosis/health_pe..._personnel.cfm

Look, don't get me wrong, the point wasn't how much better Cuba is than America. I would never agree to such a notion. The argument was based upon Vince's unwillingness to even hold a remotely mature conversation on the POSSIBILITY that Cuba might do some things right.

The article about poverty and stuff there is touching, but statistically speaking, doesn't add up. It's also unfair, b/c as I have already stated, you can go to an unlimited amount of public schools here in America that have the very same problems.

I think that the Cubans have looked at what is happening in Iraq and have concluded that the United States will not be restrained by international law and international institutions," said Cuba specialist Wayne Smith, who was the top U.S. diplomat in Havana during former President Jimmy Carter's administration.

Carter's administration had some of the worst foreign policies of any president. Castro is using the war as an excuse to clean house. The U.S. will not attack Cuba, Castro is smart enough to realize this and is using his "battle against provocations" as an excuse to murder opponents. No one believes that the current war against terrorism could be applied to Cuba, they don't have oil after all.

I agree with you fully, and luckily progressive watch dog groups such as Human Rights Watch also agree with you, and continue to exploit this issue.

However, much like India tried to use the war on terror as a justification for a "pre-emptive" strike on Pakistan, Castro is merely playing the game that has been started by the U.S. It wasn't a couple of Cuban "terrorists" with a stolen boat who were responsible for 9/11, anymore than all of these Iraqi "terrorists" who are really Palestinian suicide bombers responsible for 9/11.

The point in the original radio piece was this "How will leaving Saddam in power promote peace?" It won't. The current statistcis even from left biased groups are what 10.000? WHERE'S MY 500,000? I demand more dead brown skinned babies. This war so far has killed far less than Saddam has in the past or would have in the future.

According to Human Rights Watch (http://www.hrw.org/press/2003/04/iraq042703.htm), the amount dead is in fact higher post-war than during the war.

Violence isn't the only problem. OXFAM points out another issue, mainly being the lack of needed supplies in Iraq's over crowded hospitals (http://www.oxfamamerica.org/news/art5201.html). Luckily we won't want to make the same mistakes we have with Afghanistan, so the U.S. will probably be pumping aid into Iraq (already more money per head going into Iraq than there is right now in Afghanistan).

The war in Iraq is far from over, my friend.

Whether we can win the peace remains to be seen, but I hardly consider people who promised me 100's of thousands dead as prophetic or even competent.

I for one never made such promises, and why in God's name would I? If the death totals in this war were -5 I would've been elated, but unfortunately, due to looting, violence, instability attributable to our own incompetence, as well as the pending risk of disease and famine, those numbers may be on the rise.

Also, you're missing a key point. Earlier this year, before the war, Rumsfeld said the U.S. wasn't ruling out the use of WMD on Baghdad. A NUKE ON BAGHDAD!? Could you imagine the outcry???? Why do you think our military was so careful and diligent (sp?)?? Do you think it's because they have a general love and feeling of concern for the enemy? Screw that, it's kill or be killed, right? I for one, as do many others, attribute our nations concern during this war TO the peace movement. So, you shouldn't be chastizing anti-war protestors for not "producing the numbers," rather, you should be thanking us for preventing them.

[HitlerWasReich]

http://www.ncpa.org/pi/internat/pdinter/april98c.html
cuba has good literacy but that doesn't mean they aren't poor. They live in daily poverty and teaching them to read and providing care doesn't mean they have money. Provide a link discussing the poverty or hunger in Cuba, economics not education. A good literacy rate and healthcare system do not necessarily mean Cuba is without poverty.

Show me an inner-city school in our American paradise that doesn't need the same thing.
our schools may not have top of the line computers in every room but they aren't nearly as bad as you say. Have you seen them? Been in one?. The real improvement in our schools needs to come from student motivation and parents actually making sure their children do their work. Many parents feel that education is the school's responsibility and that they don't have to do anything. Not everyone is like this but those who care are the ones who succeed.
http://www.eastbayexpress.com/issues...l/1/index.html I believe this story tells more about the attittudes of some lower class families than about African Americans in particular.

The doctor said that he treated about fifteen burn cases every day in the course of an eight-hour shift, often children who were trying to light loose gunpowder.
Like kids playing with fireworks, not the armies job. Many people knew there would be looting and retallion as prisoners in a repressed regime vented their frustrations on the ones who had wronged them and the institutions that had taken their livelihood

I for one never made such promises
A shame most liberal pundits and human rights groups did.
as well as the pending risk of disease and famine
I am too lazy to provide a link, but the U.S. saved 500,00 Afganis by
providing food and distribution during an expected winter famine last year.
Castro is merely playing the game that has been started by the U.S.
The U.S. is merely playing the game everyone else does.
Castro has done things like this before, the U.S. is not neccessary for his repression.

Ah politics. Rumsfeld's startegy was to remind the world that we too have weapons of mass distraction. If you use chemical weapons we might just use a nuclear weapon. Everyone called Reagon crazy but he finally ended the cold war. Was a nuke used in Iraq? No. Did the "Gulf War II" end with a surprisingly bloodless conclusion ? Yes. Have we scared the shit out of Syria, North Korea and Iran? Yes.