Go Back   I-Mockery Forum > I-Mockery Discussion Forums > Philosophy, Politics, and News
FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #76  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 10:29 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore
How is it that a Taliban free Afghanistan would serve as an example, but a Saddam free Iraq means nothing?

Afghanistan was a vessel. It could've just as easily been Sudan, maybe even Indonesia.

I think your focus on soil and brand names is misguided.
Who said anything about a free Afghanistan, period? I honestly don't care about any other nation's freedom. They want freedom, they kill the tyrants. Otherwise, they aren't worth bothering with. What I was proposing was the severe punishment Afghanistan should have received.

And if it was those other nations instead, I'd say the same thing.

Brand names make the world go around.
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #77  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 10:33 PM       
So you really only care about killing people, right?

As long as we kill a bunch of towel heads, we can call it even?
Reply With Quote
  #78  
ziggytrix ziggytrix is offline
Mocker
ziggytrix's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: i come from the water
ziggytrix is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 10:37 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abcdxxxx
What else is new, huh Reverand Ziggy?
This guy isn't my character, if that's what you're implying. I assure you, I'm quite done arguing in this particular forum. The proverbial dead horse is a fine powder now as far as I'm concerned.

That hardly means I can't find some sick satisfaction in these pissing contests. It only means that I no longer wish to participate in this particular form of 'debate'.

cheers,
Z
Reply With Quote
  #79  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 10:44 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore
So you really only care about killing people, right?

As long as we kill a bunch of towel heads, we can call it even?
Let me know when you want to debate, rather than putting words in my mouth, mkay?

I was pretty sure you were better than that.
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #80  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 10:45 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggytrix
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abcdxxxx
What else is new, huh Reverand Ziggy?
This guy isn't my character, if that's what you're implying. I assure you, I'm quite done arguing in this particular forum. The proverbial dead horse is a fine powder now as far as I'm concerned.

That hardly means I can't find some sick satisfaction in these pissing contests. It only means that I no longer wish to participate in this particular form of 'debate'.

cheers,
Z
I'm beginning to see what you are talking about.

Both people I've been debating with have gone to great lengths to put words in my mouth, rather than to answer what I actually said.
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #81  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 10:59 PM       
You two should date.

You yourself said you only care about revenge, so please don't accuse me of being the flippant one, Jack. If punishing Afghanistan because it feels good is the best you got, ok, I'm fine with that. But please don't resort to the old message board crutch of "I'm so above this board and its methods!" Congratulations, you're a shining city on the hill for the rest of us to aspire towards.

Let me know when you want to stop pouting and pick up what was a pretty good discussion.
Reply With Quote
  #82  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 11:02 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore
You two should date.

You yourself said you only care about revenge, so please don't accuse me of being the flippant one, Jack. If punishing Afghanistan because it feels good is the best you got, ok, I'm fine with that. But please don't resort to the old message board crutch of "I'm so above this board and its methods!" Congratulations, you're a shining city on the hill for the rest of us to aspire towards.

Let me know when you want to stop pouting and pick up what was a pretty good discussion.
Heh. I said we should have taken revenge on the country that helped harm us.

You took that to "we should kill all towelheads", or some such rubbish.

I'd say the same thing if it had been Italy, or Sweden.

But for some reason, you decided to make it a racial issue. You want to poison the well? Do it on someone else's time.
Or you can respond to what I actually said.

You decide.
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #83  
ziggytrix ziggytrix is offline
Mocker
ziggytrix's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: i come from the water
ziggytrix is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 11:06 PM       
Sure, we could go on a double with you and ABCD to see that new Oliver Stone debacle. And to show what a good sport I am, I'll even buy the first round of popcorn.
Reply With Quote
  #84  
Abcdxxxx Abcdxxxx is offline
Mocker
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Abcdxxxx is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 11:07 PM       
Damn Ziggy, passive aggressive much? He just gave me flashbacks.

Reverand - if you want to debate, you're going to need to come to terms with the fact that we're not all going to share in your disjointed logic and see contradictory statements as sensible responses. I understand, your stance could be complex...if that's the case, why not stick to arguments based around factual information and lay off the "I just don't care" arguments. If you take the time, we'll take the time. I'm not going to make it easy on you to agree with me, or even like me... that's how I'll know you really get it once you do come around and agree with me, even just a little bit. Otherwise, you'll feel like this is a waste of time and get all personal like DJ Ziggytrix.
Reply With Quote
  #85  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 5th, 2006, 11:12 PM       
Spare me. "The Arab is at your feet or at your throat," am I right?

I frankly don't care about what you think of muslims and/or Arabs in general. People can hate each other all they like, as long as they do not act upon it, be it through terrorism, financing terrorism, or outright war.

You said we should punish Afghanistan, punish the Taliban, and I guess punish specific members of Al Qaeda. You've utterly failed to explain how doing this would end the problem, or make us any safer, which is what this is really all about, correct?

You and I are in agreement that this ultimately needs to be about American national security. I think your theory on how to attain this is terribly short sighted, and frankly wrong. But I actually have more respect for it, because it at least seems to be founded in a theoretically "realist" approach (this is in fact why I think this is a liberal war, if only the liberals could figure that out).
Reply With Quote
  #86  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 6th, 2006, 12:13 AM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore
Spare me. "The Arab is at your feet or at your throat," am I right?

I frankly don't care about what you think of muslims and/or Arabs in general. People can hate each other all they like, as long as they do not act upon it, be it through terrorism, financing terrorism, or outright war.

You said we should punish Afghanistan, punish the Taliban, and I guess punish specific members of Al Qaeda. You've utterly failed to explain how doing this would end the problem, or make us any safer, which is what this is really all about, correct?

You and I are in agreement that this ultimately needs to be about American national security. I think your theory on how to attain this is terribly short sighted, and frankly wrong. But I actually have more respect for it, because it at least seems to be founded in a theoretically "realist" approach (this is in fact why I think this is a liberal war, if only the liberals could figure that out).
You go around expecting this crop of liberals to figure ANYTHING out, and you're going to be waiting a long time. There are no Harry Trumans or George Washingtons waiting in the wings.

As for my theory? It has worked in the past, when dealing with the culture in question. You aren't going to scare a fundamentalist Muslim with death in battle, but he also knows he doesn't get his 70-whatever virgins if he's just squashed like a bug.

Basically, I'd have had a stealth bomber or three over Kabul, etc, by September 12th. Mullah Omar would have been given one (1) chance to hand over Bin Ladin, with a deadline to agree of 5 minutes, and 1 day to actually comply.

Whether he did or not, our point would have been made. If he did, he'd have been forced to back down, losing much face. If he didn't, Kabul would be a glass-bottomed lake, and again, our point would have been made. At least it would have been made much more effectively than our blundering around in Iraq has accomplished.

Kitchener did just fine with this sort of lesson, and he didn't have the weapons we have today.
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #87  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 01:10 PM       
It's Fascism -- And It's Islamic
By Victor Davis Hanson

George Bush recently declared that we are at war with "Islamic fascism." Muslim-American groups were quick to express furor at the expression. Middle Eastern autocracies complained that it was provocative and insensitive.

Critics of the term chosen by the president, however, should remember what al-Qaida, the Taliban, Hezbollah, Hamas and other extremist Muslim groups have said and done. Like the fascists of the 1930s, the leaders of these groups are authoritarians who brook no dissent in their efforts to impose a comprehensive system of submission upon the unwilling.

Osama bin Laden urged Muslims to kill any American they could find, and then tried to fulfill that vow on Sept. 11. Hezbollah's Hassan Nasrallah bragged that "the Jews love life, so that is what we shall take away from them" - and then started a war. Iran's president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, promises to "wipe out" Israel, and is seeking the nuclear means to do so.

Sharia law and dreams of pan-Islamic global rule fuel their ambitions. Once again, they seek to fool Western liberals through voicing a litany of perpetual hurts. Like the Nazis who whined about the Versailles Treaty that ended World War I, and alleged maltreatment of Germans in the Sudetenland, for years Islamists harped about American troops stationed in Saudi Arabia, the U.N. embargo of Iraq and the occupation of Gaza and Lebanon.

But when each complaint was settled, another louder one sprung up; these grievances, it turned out, were pretexts for a larger sense of victimhood, jealousy and lost pride. And appeasement - treating the first World Trade Center bombing as a mere criminal justice matter or virtually ignoring the attack on the USS Cole - only spurred on further aggression.

Islamic fascism is also anti-democratic and characteristically reactionary. It conjures up a past of Islamic influence that existed before the supposed corruption of modernism. Like Hitler, Mussolini and Tojo, who sought to recapture lost mythical Aryan, Roman or samurai purity, so Islamic fascists talk in romantic terms of the ancient caliphate.

Anti-Semitism is a tenet of fascism, then and now. But so is a generic hatred for unbelievers, homosexuals and blacks. The latter are slurred in the Arab media, while homosexuals were rounded up under the Taliban and the Iranian mullacracy.

"Mein Kampf" sells well under its translated title "Jihadi." President Ahmadinejad recently suggested in a sympathetic letter to the German chancellor that the Holocaust was little more than an "alibi" used by the victors of World War II to keep the defeated down.

Even now, it is hard to distinguish the slurs against Jews ("pigs and apes") used in the Middle Eastern media from the venom of Joseph Goebbels' propaganda. Goose-stepping and stiff-armed salutes at Iranian and Hezbollah parades are conscious imitations of past fascist armies.

Some object that the term "Islamic fascism" is too vague to encompass the differing agendas of diverse groups such as the Wahhabis, al-Qaida and Hezbollah. But just as racist German Nazis found common ground with Asian supremacists in Japan, so too the shared hatred of the West trumps the internecine rivalries of present-day Islamists.

The common denominators are extremist views of the Koran (thus the term Islamic), and the goal of seeing authoritarianism imposed at the state level by force (thus the notion of fascism). The pairing of the two words conveys a precise message: the old fascism is back, but now driven by a radical fundamentalist creed of Islam.

Others object that fascism conjures up images of past huge armies, and thus exaggerates only a moderate threat from today's ragtag jihadists. But Iran is seeking a bomb far more powerful than anything Hitler had at his disposal. About 2,400 Nazi V-1 buzz bombs in World War II reached their London targets. Nearly 4,000 Katyushas hit tiny Israel in about a month. And the petroleum of the Middle East is the lever by which the Islamic fascists hope to overturn an oil-hungry world.

In contrast, the fuzzy "war on terror" is the real inexact usage. The United States has never fought against an enemy's tools - such as German submarines or the Soviet KGB - but only against those who employ them. Other groups today use terror - like narco-dealers and Basque separatists - but this war at this time is not against them.

The real problem is not that "Islamic fascism" is inaccurate or mean-spirited, but that this identification earns such vehement disdain in Europe and the United States. That hysteria may tell us as much about the state of a demoralized West as the term itself does about our increasingly emboldened enemies.

Victor Davis Hanson is a classicist and historian at the Hoover Institution, Stanford University, and author, most recently, of "A War Like No Other: How the Athenians and Spartans Fought the Peloponnesian War." You can reach him by e-mailing author@victorhanson.com.
©2006 Tribune Media Services
Reply With Quote
  #88  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 08:48 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore
It's Fascism -- And It's Islamic
By Victor Davis Hanson
An op-ed from Victor "the traitor" Hanson.

Nice.

Next we'll be hearing op-eds from Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, and Michael Savage.
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #89  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:02 PM       
If you can't discuss the ideas and substance presented, then don't bother posting.
Reply With Quote
  #90  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:05 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore
If you can't discuss the ideas and substance presented, then don't bother posting.
The "substance" of an op-ed?

How is that any different than posting Michael Moore's blatherings?
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #91  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:18 PM       
The only person blathering here is you. You skirted serious discussion a long time ago, and then reverted to the age old "you guys are putting words in my mouth, I'm so offended" crap. Now you're resorting to another message board standard-- attack the source, ignore the substance.

One big difference between him and say Hannity is that Hanson is a military historian, and while you may disagree with his argument (we apparently will never know, cuz you can't actually refute his claims), he is certainly qualified enough to share it.

As for him being a "traitor"-- maybe you shouldn't rely on google searches to bash people. The effort you spent on that could've been spent on reading the piece.

If he's such a fool, and so clueless, well then surely it will be reflected in his writing. Why don't you try responding to that? Otherwise, I repeat what I said above-- don't bother.
Reply With Quote
  #92  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:21 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore

As for him being a "traitor"-- maybe you shouldn't rely on google searches to bash people.
You like to assume a lot, don't you?
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #93  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:28 PM       
Okay, seriously, enough.

It's like you're going for the grand slam of whiney.
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Preechr Preechr is offline
=======
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: NA
Preechr is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:40 PM       
Kevin, you seem particularly new at this.

Is that true?
__________________
mburbank~ Yes, okay, fine, I do know what you meant, but why is it not possible for you to get through a paragraph without making all the words cry?

How can someone who obviously thinks so much of their ideas have so little respect for expressing them? How can someone who so yearns to be taken seriously make so little effort?!
Reply With Quote
  #95  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:43 PM       
Are you asking a question?
Reply With Quote
  #96  
The Good Reverend Roger The Good Reverend Roger is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
The Good Reverend Roger is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:45 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore
Are you asking a question?
I guess not.
__________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?
Reply With Quote
  #97  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 09:47 PM       
You like to hit keys on your keyboard, don't you?
Reply With Quote
  #98  
Preechr Preechr is offline
=======
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: NA
Preechr is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 10:17 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore
You like to hit keys on your keyboard, don't you?
Are you talking to me?
__________________
mburbank~ Yes, okay, fine, I do know what you meant, but why is it not possible for you to get through a paragraph without making all the words cry?

How can someone who obviously thinks so much of their ideas have so little respect for expressing them? How can someone who so yearns to be taken seriously make so little effort?!
Reply With Quote
  #99  
KevinTheOmnivore KevinTheOmnivore is offline
Mocker
KevinTheOmnivore's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
KevinTheOmnivore is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 10:18 PM       
You think it's all about you, don't you?
Reply With Quote
  #100  
Preechr Preechr is offline
=======
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: NA
Preechr is probably a spambot
Old Sep 7th, 2006, 10:21 PM       
It' NOT?!
__________________
mburbank~ Yes, okay, fine, I do know what you meant, but why is it not possible for you to get through a paragraph without making all the words cry?

How can someone who obviously thinks so much of their ideas have so little respect for expressing them? How can someone who so yearns to be taken seriously make so little effort?!
Reply With Quote
Reply



Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

   


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:28 AM.


© 2008 I-Mockery.com
Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.