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Preechr · #76

Free will is the ability to defy God's will. The apple and the tree of life were symbolic of mankind's self-determination, because the ability to defy God is the only thing that makes our existance anything other than some sort of dietal diversion. I don't personally believe the sum of our lives is unnecessary or whimsical, but the final result is predetermined even if the path to that point is mostly left up to us.

If we sometimes make decisions in line with those that God would have made for us, it's only concidental because our decisions are only ever self-serving.

The ultimate goal of free will in that it's the defiance of God is the murder of God by man, and all our actions as a species lead to that eventual conclusion. By incessantly supplanting nature with constructs of our own we are serving that goal, and most of our technological progress is leading to the eventual replacement of God's designs on every level we have so far been able to perceive with those of our own making.

The nature of civilization itself is that which was found in nature, altered to benefit man specifically. Nature is treated by us as an enemy of civilization.

This is argued with the idea that our ability to create technology was given to us to improve the world as it was created, but that implies imperfection in God's intentions which doesn't seem to square well with belief in a perfect creator.

None of this is to say we will achieve our goal. I suppose that in our efforts to destroy God we'll have to eventually find some way to perceive her, proving her existence finally, which might lead to some ultimate plot twist in our story. This is also mostly only concerning the actions of men as a group, not our individual choices, but there's a relationship there that's more than casually linked.

derrida · #77

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brandon

Also, I don't know of anyone who has suggested that it's ok to kill innocent Muslim children. Maybe it's just because I don't live in a Red State.

I think this is what immortal goat was getting at-

God: LIFE IS NOT YOURS TO TAKE

"pig-fuckers": Well, you heard the man: suicide and abortion are bad. But alas! I am psychologically unable to confront the prospect that innocents are indirectly killed as a direct result of my government's actions so it sure is lucky that I came equipped with this useful moral calculator! Equivocation has never been so much fun!

Helm · #78

I don't care to entertain the notion of me being 'better' than anybody. What sort of abstract scale of betterness would one use to measure himself up to other people? That's bullshit. And since this is the philosophy board (or maybe because I'm generally tired of this) I will not reply in kind to the random insults. I'll explain myslef.

I think Command Prompt is sincerily kinda stupid if he is posting there really basic and naive notions of his as if they're philosophical theorems of the highest degree, so should I not tell you that you're not AMAZINGLY BRILLIANT? It's not an insult, it's recognizing a fact. And that other person with the ass climber sig, you're like 14 (or at least you look 14? I don't know) and you've never even read one thing about all these difficult stuff you're discussing here so I thought it best to tell you to stop posting because you're not only embarassing yourself, you're also not helping the thread. I'm not telling you to stop posting on the internet, go right ahead and pump your post count until your anus starts to dribble a brown-reddish liquid. But this thread doesn't stand to gain a lot from your input, just saying.

ziggytrix · #79

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helm

I don't care to entertain the notion of me being 'better' than anybody. What sort of abstract scale of betterness would one use to measure himself up to other people?

How bout "My God could kick your God's ass" - but since they aren't around at the moment how bout "We'll fight and whichever one of us wins obviously has God on our side."