the end of western society

[mburbank]

So, lets see now. You've lived with some foreigners who were okay by you becuase they assimilated. Leaving aside the fact that your personal experience with a few people is meaningless in terms of understanding any sort of behavioral trend, who have you spent time with who has NOT assimilated? What do you know about their lives? How can you make any sort of informed opinion without knowing something about both sides?

I cannot thank you enough for telling me the race of yet NOTHER of your alleged girlfriends. We can now list her next to the 'beatiful African American' and the 'hot li'l Latina' all she needs is an adjective and she'll be complete. How about 'inflatable'?

"This ESL shit is annoying, bi-lingual education is moronic, and lets be honest here that American culture is more superior than any culture on earth"

You should thank your living daylights for ESL, or you'd still be speaking Latvian or Urdu or whatever the hell your native tongue is. Nothing can be 'more superior' any more than it can be 'more better'. Your inistence on cultural superiority (a relative and unmeasurable quality at best) is infantile, and matches your personal, equally infantile need to feel superior.

"so lets quit acting like everyone is equal to us in the US, when it is VERY obvious that they are not!"
See, I had this wierd idea that God created everyone equal. Your kind of a big squirmy bag of nasty, aren't you? Why is being better than other people so important to you? Why should you be put on a pedestal?

[kellychaos]

Originally Posted by mburbank

Many Greeks learn American ways without relinquishing language or culture. My guess? Beyond hating the guy behind the counter at the local seven eleven, you know shit all nothing about current imigrants.

With all due respect, Max, I think that we've taken more from the Greek ideology of republican government than the vice versa ... Our constitution is at least loosely based on the Greek city-state form of government... just my $.02 ... carry on.

[AChimp]

I think that it's quite ironic at how Vince seems to pull all these analogies out of his ass. It's like how I was arguing with thekapn and it turned out that he had lived with a bunch of French dudes and a gay guy from Nigeria.

$20 says we could get Vince to claim his mom was black under the right circumstances.

[mburbank]

I know, there's a wierd sort of symptico between Kapn', Naldo and Vince. Naldo and Kap'n have the "I can believe it's butter" Afrcian American thing going on, and kap'n and Vince have the "Hah! You say I know nothing about Crippled Lesbian Farm Workers, but it just so happens my boss is a Crippled Lesbian Farm Worker, and she and her partner agree with everything I say! Don't believe me? I'll post an affidavit with their pictures and mine pictures of myself and fingerprints of both of them and my own fingerprints! Go on, just dare me to do it and I will and then who will the Jackass be looking like out of it? Simple as that."

[AntiMaster]

Originally Posted by VinceZeb

First off, you need to read a dictionary and learn the meaning of the word racism. Bigotry and prejudice is in our county, and it will be until the end of time. That's called life. Racism means you believe in the genetic superiority of a certain race and that allows that particular race to dominate a lower-class of race.

Second off, there is a huge difference between the immigrants of 100 years ago and today. My great-grandparents came from Italy in 1923. They went through the same crap all the other Italians did. But there is the thing. Immigrants back then wanted to be a part of America, be a part of the land of opportunity. Now, immigrants want to act like they are in greater Mexico or China or Japan or whatever. We are a country that absorbs other cultures and creates our own.

Gee thanks for the clarification Vince. I havent 'read' a dictionary in a while, oh hell, in fact never. I usually refer to a dictionary.

Let me try & understand what you're saying. So you believe that the your ancestors were good immigrants who integrated quickly & contributed to their new loving nation?

Originally Posted by VinceZeb

But the immigrants now, not all but a growing majority doesn’t want to learn English or be a part of America. They want to be in their little Chinas or Tokyo’s or Istanbul’s and just associate with their own kind, so to speak, instead of being a part of the wholeness of American culture.

You mean the italians picked up english pretty quickly? They didnt form little italys or subcultures within the U.S.? They didnt speak Italian to their children? You should read a bit more often. Yeah those funny looking symbols on curiously flat & thin smashed up wood is called writing.

I believe that in an earlier post you made it sound as if you're against racism & bigotry.

Originally Posted by VinceZeb

we, as a society, need to get over this racial inferiority/superiority crap

Well you sure took a dump on that statement with your response to my reply.

You dont deserve any 'Count Chocula', go eat some shit nuggets.

[Jeanette X]

i have felt for some time that western society, the "good" and the "bad" nations, the rich and the poor, might possibly fall to the status of a third-world country due to internal strife from a "counter-cultural" revolution and some sort of clandestine international...for lack of a better word, agenda.

How would changing prayerbooks and such lower us to the status of the third world?


europe and the U.S. face their own crises, but not so much from a threat of invasion. unchecked immigration from arab states into europe and mexicans into the United States may be just as dangerous to western society as open warfare.

in the U.S., there are approximately 30 million foreign born (non-european) people, 9-10 million of whom are in this country illegaly.

But don't Eurpean immigrants also come here illegally?

anti-catholicism has become almost a war cry in some circles and any opposition to them is disregarded as "blasphemy."

I have never heard anyone, even the hardcore atheists I know, calling a defense of Catholicism or any religion "Blasphemy".

it goes so far as to force churches to change hymals and prayer books to suit the needs and desires of a few who took offense;

Who forces it?

or of course, history and education are not to be spared either. throughout the country, the visages of many historical heroes: "stonewall" jackson, Robert E. Lee, Thomas Jefferson, and George Washington for example, are being removed (and in some cases irreperably damaged) so that museums and cities can be more "politically correct."

Do you have some examples of this occuring?

"so lets quit acting like everyone is equal to us in the US, when it is VERY obvious that they are not!"

Our founding fathers, who you profess to admire, stated the opposite:
"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal..."

lets be honest here that American culture is more su
perior than any culture on earth, so lets quit acting like everyone is equal to us in the US, when it is VERY obvious that they are not!

While I believe our government is superior in many ways, I do not believe that a culture is superior to another. Why is ours superior vince?

But the immigrants now, not all but a growing majority doesn’t want to learn English or be a part of America. They want to be in their little Chinas or Tokyo’s or Istanbul’s and just associate with their own kind, so to speak, instead of being a part of the wholeness of American culture.

There is no way one can survive in a country without eventually learning the language. And surely your italian ancestors had their own "Little Italy" that they lived in. Also, please define what you mean by "part of America".

[mburbank]

Jeanette, be fair. Vince has some difficulty communicating and all he meant was he's a big, greasy bag of crap.

[Jeanette X]

Well Max, I am personally going to try to debate with him as well as I can. I'd really like remain a neutral observer and questioner in The Mother of All Flame Wars that is going on with you and Vince.

I have to admit, this is the most incredible flame war I have ever seen. This is definetly one for the history books.

[ItalianStereotype]

hey, half of those quotes were mine. don't drag me into this.

[mburbank]

I'm not sure I'd call setting a bag of crap on fire a War, exactly. All that's left for me to do is ring the doorbell and run.

[Ninjavenom]

If you wrote a book, i'd read it, Stereotype.

[cba1067950]

Originally Posted by mburbank

See, I had this wierd idea that God created everyone equal.

You = Him ?

[Protoclown]

What = the fuck?

[VinceZeb]

Max, Max, Max..... you are a classic liberal. Which means you are a classic idiot. But then again you do work in a worthless museum doing a job that doesn't benefit the world, so its understandable that you would try to make yourself look more important than you are.

ESL is English as a SECOND language, stupid. That means that kids are taught in TWO DIFFERENT LANGUAGES in school, so instead of learning 1 language good, which should be ENGLISH, they learn two languages with no real gain to themselves. This has been reported as being crap over and over and over and over again. Maybe if you would stop getting off over 5,000 year old baking recipie manuscripts and read a fucking paper you would know something.

Yes, Max, I am a culturalist. I feel that the culture and ways of life in America are superior to anyone elses on planet Earth. What culture is better than us, MaxiPad? China, Russia, Iraq, Cuba, Syria or Zimbawabe?

What about the Nazis, Max? Were they not a inferior culture? I can see Max now in Nazi-Era Germany....

"Wear this Star, now Jew!"

"Sure, it's just for our own protection! I'm a dumb idiot who thinks everybody's culture is equal and a-o.k.! I shouldn't judge!"

"We are here to take your wife and child to our Nazi concentration rape and death camps!"

"SURE! Since I am stupid enough to believe your culture is just as valid and equal as mine is, you can go do what you want with them!"

"It's time to jump in that oven, Max!"

"Will do! Since your culture is as good as mine, who am I to say that I should not die for your culture!"

Sound about right, Max?

A document written by people said God created everyone equal, when it is obvious that means that people have equal rights and oppurunities in life. People are NOT equal after that, Max. I have more abilities than a crippled child that is comatose, and you have more abilities than others. I am "better" than a lot of people and "worse" than a hell of a lot more. Equality is in the eyes of the law and the soul is in the eyes of God. Other than that, don't say that some druggie that can't even walk is my fucking equal, because he is simply not. Human equality in everything is what Communists believe can be done, that we can achieve this human prefection. That is bullshit, which is VERY obvious to anyone with 10 brain cells.

I don't feel a need to be superior. I am me. That's all anyone else could want to be, is just being themselves. But it's stupid to not realize that a certain culture is better than another. We are better than the culture in certain European countries that blames WOMEN for being raped by Muslim men. Please explain to me how that is a nice culture. In fact, explain it to their husbands/boyfriends/brothers/fathers, you fucking queef.

[mburbank]

Well, I'm relieved you're back to talking about Rape again. I was cncerned you might have lost your erection.

Likewise I hope you enjoyed your fantasy of my wife, children and eventually me being murdered by Nazis. Your right, that is logical outgrowth of question America's cultural superiority, and it's a wake up call to see it in that light. Rest assured that you managed to illustrate this point and show the world what I was truly thinking without, you know, kind of making yourself look like a sick, degenrate bastard who desperately needs an introductory high school freshman English course. You don't need to worry, it was a very classy, tour deforce handling of a difficult subject, but I think you showed the same disarming humor Mel Brooks showed when he wrote The Producers. Well done, sir.

Thankfully, you have a keen grasp of humor. It's clear you were being ironic with your whole, brilliant ESL screed and were only pretending to miss my rather simple joke, the implication that English must be your second language.

"you do work in a worthless museum doing a job that doesn't benefit the world,"

I'm sure most folks would certainly agree that your pivotal job in a private school in St. Louis, whatever it might actually be, is far more significant than working in the Exhibits Department of The Boston Museum of Science. The only thing Museums are really good for is looting. They don't do much else, which is why generally they are faddy, flash in the pan institutions.

In closing, there's really only one word of advice I can offer to a man who's demonstrated his mntal metal so thoroughly.

Velcro.

You'll never be late to work again once you ditch those insidous 'lace up' shoes.

[Vibecrewangel]

It's funny, I tend to agree with quite a bit of Zeb's ranting.....he is a bit extreme for my tastes and beliefs, but some of his rants, if spoken calmly would have a few points.

I do however disagree with his take on museums.

I also disagree completely with this

ESL is English as a SECOND language, stupid. That means that kids are taught in TWO DIFFERENT LANGUAGES in school, so instead of learning 1 language good, which should be ENGLISH, they learn two languages with no real gain to themselves.

ESL or English as a second language does not mean "kids are taught in TWO DIFFERENT LANGUAGES in school"
It means that the studens who are in ESL classes are learing English as their second language. This because their native language is not English. Hence, English AS A second language. Just like if you learned German or French. That would be your second language.

[VinceZeb]

Vibe, I do not claim to have a lot of tact. And since I am trying to type fast and respond to posts, I usually do not proofread a lot of the posts I type. And yes, I am pretty extreme at times. But hey, It's just my way.

[sadie]

vibe, i'm glad you could interpret that shit he passed for english.

[Vibecrewangel]

I must be high......

[VinceZeb]

Thanks for interjecting that just precious response, sadie. We couldn't have survived without it.

[sadie]

lack of tact obviously isn't the major problem here, vince.

[Vibecrewangel]

Seriously though Zeb......

Do you see the difference in what you thought ESL was and what it is?

[mburbank]

He's confusing ESL with Bilingual Ed.

Hssst! Vince! Just so you know, Bilingual Ed is not the guy working the counter at Seven Eleven!

And lack of proofreading doesn't account for your writing. The fact that you are a very, very bad writer is what accounts for it.

[Jeanette X]

ESL or English as a second language does not mean "kids are taught in TWO DIFFERENT LANGUAGES in school"
It means that the studens who are in ESL classes are learing English as their second language. This because their native language is not English. Hence, English AS A second language. Just like if you learned German or French. That would be your second language.

Well jeez Vince! You should be in favorof this! You want these kids to learn English, don't you?!

I have more abilities than a crippled child that is comatose, and you have more abilities than others. I am "better" than a lot of people and "worse" than a hell of a lot more.

There are different kinds of equality. Equality in terms of ablities is one thing, whereas equality in terms of rights is another.

But then again you do work in a worthless museum doing a job that doesn't benefit the world,

Museums are worthless and don't benefit the world?! Wow, I guess you really are a Philistine.

[cba1067950]

Originally Posted by Protoclown

What = the fuck?

aww what happeneed proto? you used to be so clever.