What?

[Eddie]

No Satan is going to be in chains bound up! You see Satan was once in heaven. He use to be a beutiful angel. But he tried to be better then God. He took his eyes off of God and said look at me! I will be like the most high. I will be better! God cast him out of heaven. The bible said he fell down like lightning out of heaven and into hell. Satan does not want to be there. So he deceived 1 third of the angels to go with him. It is like a hurting person trying to drag everyone down with them. He is saying hey if i am going to go i am taking everyone with me!

[kahljorn]

I thought the point of going to hell was that god is so merciful he made him king of hell just like he wanted.

also i thought the story of lucifer was supposed to be about individuality.

[Eddie]

God is merciful but He did not make Satan the king of hell. Hell is not a party place. Hell is a place of torture and agony. When we say hell we are talking about the lake of fire. The bible said that the people in hell are going to look at satan and say is this the one who caused all this and deceived people? He is going to be just like the rest of them burning forever. He is not a king down there. You were saying, I thought, I thought . You see it is not by what you think. It is about what is true. The devil blinds peoples minds so they cant see the truth. He is a liar and deceiever.

[Grislygus]

Now where did I put that History of Hell thread?

[kahljorn]

I thought "Satan"(actually it was the snake) told eve to eat the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. How is he deceiving people if he's giving them knowledge, seems like god is the one who was deceiving people because he wants them to remain ignorant. CAUsING IGNORANCE OF TRUTH=DECEIT
In fact after adam and eve ate the fruit he said, "Now he's like us" and if they eat again they wil, "Become like us, immortal". So um again actually God is the one deceiving because he didn't want us to know the difference between good and evil. He's selfish and territorial. He lied to us about the nature of the tree

"Satan" is only mentioned in the bible like three times and only once in the context of actually being an evil figure.. if that.

[Esuohlim]

How do you know Hell is a lake of fire anyway. Have you been there? Did you take any pictures?

[Eddie]

Brother the devil has got you all mixed up. Be careful what you call good, evil and evil, good. God does not decieve anyone. He gave us free will. God told Adam and Eve not to eat of that one tree. The devil disguised himself as a snake and told, Eve to go ahead and eat it. She did and conviced Adam to eat it. That is were sin all started in the garden. As for the other reply. the bible talks about hell, the lake of fire in Revelations

[kahljorn]

I don't think that the snake tricked eve.

Okay two things:
first off god said not to eat the tree because if they did they would "Surely die". They didn't die from eatting the fruit. They also weren't immortal, as clearly expressed in the fact that they hadn't eaten the tree of life.
Deception one!

The bible doesn't say anything about satan being disguised as a snake. The snake is just "Crafty". Also, when he was convincing eve to eat the fruit he told her bluntly, "he told you not to eat it because your eyes would be opened to good and evil". No deceit. Blunt truth.
"You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.""

That's the only thing the snake said to eve besides asking her if god commanded them to not eat of any trees. Also, the snake is only present in like 6 verses and is never mentioned again and is never called satan. God also curses all serpents, thus fortifying the position that the serpent isn't satan but a serpent unless god made a mistake and punished serpents instead of satan.

It was EVE who said that she was deceived by the snake. The snake didn't decieve her at all, he told her the truth and she chose on her own will.

LEARN YOUR RELIGION. ZOD KNOWS AND HE WILL KICK JESUS IN THE BALLS I love religous arguments.

[Eddie]

OK here it is my wife just pulled out the bible to show you where it talks about the lake of fire. I would tell you where it is but I dont know if you will check it out. It is in, Revelations 20: 10 and the devil that decieved them was cast into the LAKE OF FIRE and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are and shall be tormented day and night forever and ever.

[kahljorn]

Why don't you have your wife crack open to the second book of genesis and read that and see how deceitful the snake is who tells the truth..
THE TRUTHING DECEIVER!

the whole bible is a fraud i mean god's supposed to be omnipotent and omniscient and yet he can't find adam or eve and has to ask them what happened and then doesn't realize that the serpent didn't actually deceive eve? what a bitch.

General Zod would've known. I think this thread just proves his superiority over god

[Eddie]

Reason being in Genesis , First thing you have to understand is God said they would surly die . And they did. They died spirtually. The reason God was looking for them in the garden was because they where dead spirtually.That which is life has fellowship with life. That which is dead cant not fellowship with life.Reason being why Jesus had to come and die on the cross and rise again was so that humanity could have fellowship ( life ) with God once again.
So in the garden what God said was true.The only way the serpent ( devil ) could enter into man was to get him to disobey God.Then that would cut God off from His plan of having life on earth.Or so the devil thought. God being all knowing all powerful had a plan all along that does destroy satan and his works. That being the blood of Jesus! It was by the death burial and ressurection that brought VICTORY over every situation in this life and the life to come.

[kahljorn]

None of that is anywhere in the bible and you are just making it up or you learned it in church and THEY were making it up.

They weren't dead and the serpent didn't lie to them. The bible doesn't say anywhere that the serpent is the devil or satan why don't you read it.

Plus that's stupid God is supposed to be omnipotent. omniscient and omnipresent doesn't mean he can only see or know life. That wouldn't be omniscient and omnipresent. fucking duh.

Again why did god punish the serpent if it was satan disguised as a serpent. shouldn't he have known? Did satan even decieve the allmightypowerful god what a pussy.

[Eddie]

Everything I wrote was and is in the bible from beginging to end.It comes down to believeing and I hope and pray that your eyes of understanding has been enlighten.May you find peace and love with God.My hope is that you will recieve His great love for you.All the debates can not deny Gods love. He has loved you with an everlasting love. He will continue to love you.No matter what names you call Him. He died for you.

[Eddie]

P.s. It says in Revelation 12:9 and the great dragon was cast out ,
that old serpent,called the devil
and satan which deceieveth the whole world he was cast out into the earth and his angels where cast out with him.

[Eddie]

Zod has no power. Remember in the end of superman 2 it got stripped away from him. Just like Satan. Jesus kicked his a-- 2 thousand years ago and superman kicked Zod's. You see good always wins over evil

[Esuohlim]

Eddie you're tapdancing around the issue

[Grislygus]

Originally Posted by kahljorn

Why don't you have your wife crack open to the second book of genesis and read that and see how deceitful the snake is who tells the truth..
THE TRUTHING DECEIVER!

the whole bible is a fraud i mean god's supposed to be omnipotent and omniscient and yet he can't find adam or eve and has to ask them what happened and then doesn't realize that the serpent didn't actually deceive eve? what a bitch.

General Zod would've known. I think this thread just proves his superiority over god

I've heard from several people who are far more intelligent than I am say that the version of Adam and Eve written in the bible isn't the original version (which was one of the works rejected for inclusion in the bible). Can anyone verify that? If it's true, I'd love to read up on the 'original'.

[Eddie]

Well the original version was written in hebrew. You can get a strongs concordance and that will help you understand the hebrew language. I would love to help you any way I can. I dont know much. My wife has a little bit of bible knowledge. I am more into the music end of it. I write and record songs for the lord. You know you can get into so many debates who is right or wrong but the whole christian walk is by faith. Jesus said blessed are they who have not seen and yet believe.

[Grislygus]

If you can help me, that's great. They've told me that Adam and Eve were in two seperate parts of the garden, the serpent was NOT Satan, (rather, the wisest of the animals who would talk with Eve), and that Satan showed up in person (in the guise of an angel) to tempt Eve.

I haven't found a single damned thing about THAT version, but enough people have told me (relatively) the same story to get me curious.

[Esuohlim]

Originally Posted by Eddie

Well the original version was written in hebrew.

I thought the original version was written by God

[Grislygus]

Nothing in the bible was. That's why the only things I really trust in it (as blasphemous as it sounds) are the ten commandments and the actual teachings of Jesus. Medieval figures in the Catholic church were corrupt, self serving, and probably burning in hell right now, so I can't say I wholeheartedly trust anything else.

[Esuohlim]

Religion in general is just too illogical for me to take seriously. If Christianity and Hinduism contradict each other because one is monotheist and the other is polytheist, then what kind of arrogant jerk would I be if I said that a billion people on this earth are wrong? And what if they are, are they going to Hell just because they didn't even know Christianity existed for half of their lives? It just seems so stupid.

[Grislygus]

I believe that is explained by Jesus being resurrected, right? He died for our sins, went into purgatory, pardoned all the heathens and all that?

[Esuohlim]

I don't know I haven't really studied religious stuff. I find it sort of boring, but then again History is my worst subject and it sort of falls into that category.

[Grislygus]

I do spectacularly well in any History, English, or art class. Took me two and a half years to get through high school algebra, though, so I guess it all evens out in the end.