Palestinians try to use a retarded boy to blow up ........

[KevinTheOmnivore]

ABC- you asked me to show you where they are, go stand with them. Rather than encouraging them, you have chosen to belittle them as whatever. I appreciate your cynicism, but you asked a question, and I answered it. I'd rather not paint the Palestinians in quite the broad stroke you and Brandon have.

Brandon- YOU are a straw man. You are a funny little straw man. From now on, whenever you post, happy little thoughts of Ray Bolger dancing and singing Ïf I only had a brain" will be playing in my head.

Brandon, if you truly don't espouse the things I've claimed, that all muslims must be terror loving, jew killing monsters, then prove it. Your "muslim ghandi" comment was either careless, crude, or uninformed. Which one was it?

EDIT: Most of my post got cut off.

Brandon, more directly to the point, I feel that my so called "strawman" was very relevant. Raygun posted this story to attack an entire group of people, not merely a small faction of their "leadership." Why does he do this? He does this in order to rationalize "kicking the crap out of them," or whatever you called the Israeli approach.

I was once quite partisan on this issue, as ABC well knows. I have become much more suppprtive of Israel, and very cynical when it comes to the "plight" of the Palestinians (as compared to other Arab nations). However, I feel that you band ABC are the exact opposite. You paint the Palestinians as unyielding, unreasonable, etc., and yet see Israel and Israelis as unquestionably giving and reasonable. I'm certain they are. Go to a settlement with IDF soldiers, ask THOSE Israelis to compromise, be agreeable, and you will get a struggle. Perhaps violence. Does this compare to a suicide bomb on a public bus? Of course not. But my overall point is that you seem to approach this with a zealotry that has only furthered tensions and conflict rather than resolving it.

[mburbank]

"If I tried their would be no contest seeing how Brandon has already wiped out your entire argument."
-Naldo

In other words, you have no ideas on moving toward peace. Don't feel bad, neither does the administration.

[Brandon]

Brandon, if you truly don't espouse the things I've claimed, that all muslims must be terror loving, jew killing monsters, then prove it. Your "muslim ghandi" comment was either careless, crude, or uninformed. Which one was it?

My comment was meant to be nothing more than a snide callback to previous posts in other threads that, as far as I'm concerned, minimized the Palestinians' culpability in the conflict. It wasn't meant to paint all muslims as evil monsters; you just read into it that way so you could attack me more easily.

But I'll admit: it was careless. I apologize if it was insensitive to muslims. However, I'm not on the record either, and I figured the political correctness police weren't out to bust heads on the I-Mockery message boards.

And seriously, fuck you and your "relevant" straw man. I don't deserve your shit just because I disagree with you on this issue. You seriously need to examine what kind of comments YOU'VE been making before you start labeling people as "zealots."

[KevinTheOmnivore]

"My comment was meant to be nothing more than a snide callback to previous posts in other threads that, as far as I'm concerned, minimized the Palestinians' culpability in the conflict. It wasn't meant to paint all muslims as evil monsters; you just read into it that way so you could attack me more easily."

No, I read the words you typed and responded. Brandon, do you believe that there are ANY Palestinians who would prefer non-violent measures against Israel???

"And seriously, fuck you and your "relevant" straw man. I don't deserve your shit just because I disagree with you on this issue. You seriously need to examine what kind of comments YOU'VE been making before you start labeling people as "zealots.""

It's not a mere disagreement. I think you'd find we agree on several matters pertaining to this conflict (which I in fact began to list out in the post that got cut off). Furthermore, I'd challenge you to point out comments I've made that would classify as extremist. I don't know that I made a blanket indictment against the Israeli "leadership," nor did I make a flippant comment over whether or not Israelis wanted peace seriously enough. I also never said that the Palestinians have done everything nice possible, and the Israelis in fact everything bad. I also didn't say "still waiting for the Jewish Ghandi" in reference to the IDF. So before you make any claims of who is this and who is that, you damn well better back it up.

[Brandon]

No, I read the words you typed and responded. Brandon, do you believe that there are ANY Palestinians who would prefer non-violent measures against Israel???

Yes.

What the hell do you want from me, exactly, Kevin? I already aplogized for any insensitivity in the comment. Are you looking for groveling here or are you just trying to annihilate my character? I really don't want to argue with you any more over this, so can we please just kindly drop it?

[Ant10708]

"There are Christian muslims, too."

Does that even make sense?

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Forgive me, I meant Palestinian Christians.

[Ant10708]

Oh okay.

[Abcdxxxx]

If there are Palestinian Christians then there are Palestinian Jews, and Jewish residents of Gaza are entitled to call themselves Palestinians too.

My understanding is that the Pal title was put on the Christians of Bethlehem when the PA took control, and they were told "you're Palestinians now". I don't think the climate is very comfortable for them, and like Hasidic Jews of Israel, they follow a different framework of nationalism altogether. It's conveniant politically for the PA to say "they're with us, we're diverse, the church is sacred to Palestinians too" but if you believe in a Palestinian as a nationality, with it's own language, culture, etc. then the Christians out there aren't really a part of all that. The other things is the majority of Christians were driven out entirely when the religious sites were trasnfered to the PA, and the Muslim community there has nearly taken over Bethlehem, planning construction for a massive Mosque. Anyway historically Christians have always been Christian, and it's only recently that they've been given a Palestinian Christian title.

[KevinTheOmnivore]

I'll grant you all of that. The warm, fuzzy liberal in me would like to think that they're all Palestinians. We know that that probably isn't the case.

But the fact that the Christian (and Druze?) relationship with the PA is sketchy and uneasy doesn't change the fact that they are now a part of the dynamic there, and probably would be in any sort of state set up.