Universal Health Care

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by The Leader

How do you read that and get "Death Panels?"

is a new commission to tell Congress how to control health spending.

Hence....Death Panels.

And it's a little bit different then what is usually going on. If you read the bill....which you didn't.....you would realize that there will be 500 billion dollars in CUTS to social services. That's a lot different then our usual denial of care that's literally genocide and AS I POSTED ABOVE....there is a "NEW COMMISSION" that will TELL CONGRESS how to control health spending.......I.E. DEATH PANELS.

[Zhukov]

A commission on health spending = DEATH PANEL.


Quite literally genocide. The systematic elimination of an ethnic or racial group. This is what this is.


This new commission to regulate spending on health is only interested in ethnic cleansing.

Don't you see? It's really quite obvious.

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by The Leader

How do you read that and get "Death Panels?"

Originally Posted by Zhukov

A commission on health spending = DEATH PANEL.


Quite literally genocide. The systematic elimination of an ethnic or racial group. This is what this is.


This new commission to regulate spending on health is only interested in ethnic cleansing.

Don't you see? It's really quite obvious.

No, please stop twisting my words around. And by genocide I'm sure you mean the US people. They are group right?

Please READ the article. You're all having trouble understanding because you haven't read the article. You just see me post anything and attack it. Grow up please.

The "new commission" will be in the business of "CUTTING COSTS". Very simple.

Are you just disagreeing with me for fun? I can't believe that people would have trouble following this.....

[Zhukov]

A commission on healthcare spending or cuts does not equal the deliberate and systematic elimination of a racial or religious group. Even if we push things to extremes and imagine that Death Panels exist solely to prevent people from getting treatment, letting people die of their own accord isn't really the most efficient genocide I've heard of.

Oh, and another brilliant piece of idiocy from you; if the Death Panels (seriously, I've heard enough of this phrase) are committing genocide on US citizens.... then... surely the Death Panels are made up of US citizens? Right? I mean, are they eliminating themselves as a national group? Really? They are destroying themselves ON PURPOSE through the use of dangerous new weapons such as letting people die of their own accord? The Death Panels are committing genocide on US citizens, which include themselves.


Do you think about things before you type them?


Genocide?



Come on.

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by Zhukov

A commission on healthcare spending or cuts does not equal the deliberate and systematic elimination of a racial or religious group. Even if we push things to extremes and imagine that Death Panels exist solely to prevent people from getting treatment, letting people die of their own accord isn't really the most efficient genocide I've heard of.

Oh, and another brilliant piece of idiocy from you; if the Death Panels (seriously, I've heard enough of this phrase) are committing genocide on US citizens.... then... surely the Death Panels are made up of US citizens? Right? I mean, are they eliminating themselves as a national group? Really? They are destroying themselves ON PURPOSE through the use of dangerous new weapons such as letting people die of their own accord? The Death Panels are committing genocide on US citizens, which include themselves.


Do you think about things before you type them?

So what do you believe this new commission that's meant to reign in costs will do? Give out cookies and blankets?

I've decided that you're just disagreeing with me to be silly. No one in there right mind could disagree with the facts in front of your face.

500 billion dollars in cuts to social services = death

New Commission on cuttting costs = death

More money for the insurance companies = death

But no...its all wrong....they must be doing good...they must have our best interests.....right? right?

The Washington commission, called the Health Technology Assessment, is manned by 11 bureaucrats, including a chiropractor and a "naturopath" who focuses on alternative, er, remedies like herbs and massage therapy. They consider the clinical effectiveness but above all the cost of medical procedures and technologies. If they decide something isn't worth the money, then Olympia won't cover it for some 750,000 Medicaid patients, public employees and prisoners.
So far, the commission has banned knee arthroscopy for osteoarthritis, discography for chronic back pain, and implantable infusion pumps for pain not related to cancer. This year, it is targeting such frivolous luxuries as knee replacements, spinal cord stimulation, a specialized autism therapy and MRIs of the abdomen, pelvis or breasts for cancer. It will also rule on routine ultrasounds for pregnancy, which have a "high" efficacy but also a "high" cost.
Currently, the commission is pushing through the most restrictive payment policy in the nation for drug-eluting cardiac stents—simply because bare metal stents are cheaper, even as they result in worse outcomes. If a patient is wheeled into the operating room with chest pains in an emergency, doctors will first have to determine if he's covered by a state plan, then the diameter of his blood vessels and his diabetic condition to decide on the appropriate stent. If they don't, Washington will not reimburse them for "inappropriate care."

From the same article.

[Colonel Flagg]

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

No one in there right mind could disagree with the facts in front of your face.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

Its fine to disagree with others. [...]
It's OK for people to think differently.

Oh. OK - so it's "Do as I say, not as I do." I get it.

[Zhukov]

Genocide?



I don't care about Death Panels or their existence.




GENOCIDE?



How is it genocide?

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by Colonel Flagg

Oh. OK - so it's "Do as I say, not as I do." I get it.

More grumbles and snipes i see?

I was just expressing my opinion that no one who looks at the facts I set in front of them could possibly mistake that as not being a Death Panel.

If Zhukov still doesn't want to believe it.....it's hard for me to believe he's sincere....but I have to allow him to come to his own conclusion.

Once again,

Get over it Flagg.

Originally Posted by Zhukov

I don't care about Death Panels or their existence.

Wait? You don't care about Death Panels anymore? Why.....because I just proved their existence?

The Washington commission, called the Health Technology Assessment, is manned by 11 bureaucrats, including a chiropractor and a "naturopath" who focuses on alternative, er, remedies like herbs and massage therapy. They consider the clinical effectiveness but above all the cost of medical procedures and technologies. If they decide something isn't worth the money, then Olympia won't cover it for some 750,000 Medicaid patients, public employees and prisoners.
So far, the commission has banned knee arthroscopy for osteoarthritis, discography for chronic back pain, and implantable infusion pumps for pain not related to cancer. This year, it is targeting such frivolous luxuries as knee replacements, spinal cord stimulation, a specialized autism therapy and MRIs of the abdomen, pelvis or breasts for cancer. It will also rule on routine ultrasounds for pregnancy, which have a "high" efficacy but also a "high" cost.
Currently, the commission is pushing through the most restrictive payment policy in the nation for drug-eluting cardiac stents—simply because bare metal stents are cheaper, even as they result in worse outcomes. If a patient is wheeled into the operating room with chest pains in an emergency, doctors will first have to determine if he's covered by a state plan, then the diameter of his blood vessels and his diabetic condition to decide on the appropriate stent. If they don't, Washington will not reimburse them for "inappropriate care."

From the same article.

Here it is one more time for anyone who missed it.....

[Dimnos]

Coolie, what state do you live in? What House of Rep. district are you in?

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by Dimnos

Coolie, what state do you live in? What House of Rep. district are you in?

Why does this always have to be about me personally? Why can't we talk about the facts on the table?

Look at the ideas I bring up and say what you please about them or switch the subject to something different.

[Dimnos]

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

The "new commission" will be in the business of "CUTTING COSTS". Very simple.

So currently insurance companies and the big wigs running medicare/medicade are in the business of "BLOWING CASH OUT THEIR ASSES"?

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

I can't believe that people would have trouble following this.....

Look in the mirror you moron.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

500 billion dollars in cuts to social services = death

New Commission on cuttting costs = death

More money for the insurance companies = death

All of this is nothing more than a slippery slope argument. It doesnt mean death. It means they arent going to be flushing money down the drain running pointless tests on some hypochondriac who only needs some tums.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

More grumbles and snipes i see?

This is all Im hearing form you.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

I was just expressing my opinion that no one who looks at the facts I set in front of them could possibly mistake that as not being a Death Panel.

What is it about people in glass houses?

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

If Zhukov still doesn't want to believe it.....it's hard for me to believe he's sincere....but I have to allow him to come to his own conclusion.

Zhukov is mocking you because your dumb.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

Once again,

Get over it Flagg.

Once again, get over yourself.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

Wait? You don't care about Death Panels anymore? Why.....because I just proved their existence?

What we have been REPEATEDLY telling you is that what you call a "death panel" ALREADY EXISTS. The fact that you are getting all worked up about the supposed "death panels" in the Obamacare measure is simply you BUYING INTO THE POLITICAL BULL SHIT MACHINE that your hypocrite ass has been telling everyone to avoid. God are you blind to your own crap?!

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

Why does this always have to be about me personally? Why can't we talk about the facts on the table?

I only ask because its apparent your going to keep shoveling your shit all the while telling people its gold. The only thing we can agree on is that we both dont like Obamacare, for different reasons or whatever. So whats the solution? To do our best to keep it out and to send a message to congress that the people dont want this. So I simply want to know who your Senators and your House Rep are. That way you can know who you need to vote to keep and who you need to vote out. Only trying to help you.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

Look at the ideas I bring up and say what you please about them or switch the subject to something different.

Wait? Isnt that what we have been doing and only cry about it?

[Zhukov]

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

Wait? You don't care about Death Panels anymore? Why.....because I just proved their existence?

Yeah, you certainly did.

In actual fact though, I have never cared if they existed or not. I'm just pulling you up on your constant use of the word genocide.

How is a death panel committing genocide?

[Colonel Flagg]

Originally Posted by Colonel Flagg

Oh. OK - so it's "Do as I say, not as I do." I get it.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

More grumbles and snipes i see?

Actually, Coolster, I was just pointing out two posts of yours that I read within a few minutes of each other. No trolling, no grumbling, just two direct quotations from your esteemed self. Showing, incidentally what kind of person you really are.

I should amend your second quotation above -

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

Its fine to disagree with others. Just so long as you agree with me.

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

Get over it Flagg.

I am over it. I'm actually having fun with it. Can you say the same thing?

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by Colonel Flagg

I am over it.

If you're over it why are you acting like every other person who I proved wrong online?

1. Follow me around the forum mumbling incoherently

2. Short snipes in every topic I post

3. Never challenging what I say but attacking me personally.

How old are you again?

Originally Posted by Dimnos

What we have been REPEATEDLY telling you is that what you call a "death panel" ALREADY EXISTS.

Like most of Europe, the various health bills stipulate that Congress will arbitrarily decide how much to spend on health care for seniors every year—and then invest an unelected board with extraordinary powers to dictate what is covered and how it will be paid for. White House budget director Peter Orszag calls this Medicare commission "critical to our fiscal future" and "one of the most potent reforms."
.......

Worse, it makes little room for medical innovations. The commission is mandated to go after "sources of excess cost growth," meaning treatments that are too expensive or whose coverage will boost spending. If researchers find a pricey treatment for Alzheimer's in 2020, that might be banned because it would add new costs and bust the global budget. Or it might decide that "Maybe you're better off not having the surgery, but taking the painkiller,"

This^ Death panel, which you all denied existed until I showed it to you was not always here. This is a new one. Much different then the insurance companies death panels. why you may ask? because this is now mandated by the government.....with government officials leading it. See the difference?

Good.


Hope & Change!

[Dimnos]

Originally Posted by Dimnos

What we have been REPEATEDLY telling you is that what you call a "death panel" ALREADY EXISTS. The fact that you are getting all worked up about the supposed "death panels" in the Obamacare measure is simply you BUYING INTO THE POLITICAL BULL SHIT MACHINE that your hypocrite ass has been telling everyone to avoid. God are you blind to your own crap?!

Man this is getting old.

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by Dimnos

Man this is getting old.

It doesn't matter what puppet said what about what....is it true?....that's the point....are death panels real, yes. Does Obamacare have Death panels, Yes.

What is the problem?

[Colonel Flagg]

I said I was over it, meaning over the relentless babbling on about all the things that you know to be right and why we're all blind, deaf and dumb for not seeing it too. Your response?

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

If you're over it why are you acting like every other person who I proved wrong online?

1. Follow me around the forum mumbling incoherently

2. Short snipes in every topic I post

3. Never challenging what I say but attacking me personally.

I haven't attacked you personally. I don't even know your real name. What I am pointing out to you (which in your view I guess is attacking) is your inconsistent arguments, citing of biased opinion pieces from reliable news outlets (they're called "columns"), fringe bloggers that support your worldview, etc.

For the record, I have responded once or twice in a rather (for me) long-winded manner about what I believe and why, and they have largely gone either unread (apparently), ridiculed (frequently) or ignored (most often) by you. This is the norm rather than the exception, and I believe many others have felt the same way.

As for sniping at you in every topic in which you post, I don't visit the gaming forum much, where you are quite active, so you're wrong again, dude.

Lastly, I guess you must be right about the "mumbling incoherently" part - I mean, you should know, right?

Originally Posted by TheCoolinator

How old are you again?

Check out the calender, or my profile, if you're really interested.

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by Colonel Flagg

I haven't attacked you personally. What I am pointing out to you your inconsistent arguments, citing of biased opinion pieces from reliable news outlets (they're called "columns"), fringe bloggers that support your worldview, etc.

.

Anyone else see the problem with the above statement?

Paraphrase:
"I'm not attacking you but I have to follow you around and attempt to discredit every comment you make"

Obsess much?

[Dimnos]

No

and

No

[Colonel Flagg]

I didn't say that - you paraphrased. (I didn't include the grammatical error, for example)

Let's go back to talking about "Death Panels," shall we?

[Dimnos]

Lets not.

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by Dimnos

Lets not.

Dimnos is right,

If you've read the article I posted then the conversation is pretty much over.

[Dimnos]

The one about you being gullible choad.

[TheCoolinator]

Originally Posted by Dimnos

The one about you being gullible choad.

No, The one about the Death Panels.

[Dimnos]

Right. Same same.