While we were in Fallujah

[mburbank]

While we were in Fallujah having another catastrophic success, Molsul fell. So now were in Mosul.

But see, I'm guessing the 'insurgents' have kind of figured out that we'd be coming and many of them are already gone to whatever city is going to fall apart next.

You know the only thing I ever, ever liked about W, way back when he was first a candidate? His disdain for 'Nation Building'. I thought that was pretty realistic. I worried that he thought of any sort of 'nation helping' as 'nation building' but at least he realized messing around with whole countries was a bad plan.

See, Freedom may be marching, but it marches slowly and you always know which way it's going in plenty of time to move on to the next target.

Couldn't we at least fire Li'l Donny Rumsfeld? Couldn't we have at least that much recognition that maybe things aren't going so well?

[Baalzamon]

No max, everything is going fine. Freedom is marching, and god is on our side.


How dare you give praise to our enemies by suggesting otherwise!

[Anonymous]

Come on, guys! It's time to celebrate a victory in Fallujah!

[El Blanco]

Wait. People get hurt in battle? Holy shit, we better leave.

Chojin, you better not look at any photos from D-Day.

And I wouldn't say Mosul has fallen. Increased insurgent activity? Sure. Fallen? Far from.

[Anonymous]

Consider my post defeated!

The idea is that we're supposed to be liberating these people. Or searching for WMDs. Or seeking terrorists. Or whatever the current excuse is.

I also think it's always good for people to see what's going on there instead of just hearing or reading about it (or in the case of most Americans, neither). Death is a lot easier to stomach in tallies.

[mburbank]

Hard to look at, but that's what war is.

While I think this whole damn war was uneccesary and every death and maiming in it is pointless tragedy, I'm not saying that this kind of mayhem never has to happen.

I am saying that is has to be taken seriously and all the happy crappy shit has to go. I think when Lil Donny Rumsfeld says shit like he doesn't think there will be civillian casualities he needs to wear a short with one of those maimed toddlers on it.

I think we should all have to look at it. Our kids are over there looking at it right now, that's what we're asking of them. If you absolutely feel America needs to be dealing in ths kind of mayhem and that there are no other options, okay, that's arguable. But put it up front. Don't hide it, don't sugar coat it. This is what Freedom on the March looks like.

[Preechr]

As with all things violent and essentially unjustifiable: our tax dollars at work.

[Stabby]

I saw this video on the news today:

LINK

And yes that thing happens in war, but I grow tired of the people who defend it and who say that they deserve it or would do the same. Whether they would do the same or not is irrelevant. WE invaded them. WE are there as the 'benevolant western leaders who liberated them from a tyrant' (which seems to be the only 'reason' a republican gives now). So we can't do this.

[Bass]

They should show those images everyday on broadcast tv so that maybe some of the people who support the war will realize what it is they've been supporting. Unfortnately there will still be plenty of assholes who don't care, or, worse yet, are glad that this is happening.

[Ant10708]

The same reason we don't show pictures like these is the same reason we don't show pictures of abortions on broadcast TV. People don't like to see the bad side of what they support.

You could easily just counter the effect of these pictures by showing the hostage videos of many of the people executed in Falluja because we allowed it to become a base for our enemies.

So is there any estimations yet on civilian casualties?

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Originally Posted by Preechr

As with all things violent and essentially unjustifiable: our tax dollars at work.

I would really appreciate it if you'd stop spitting on our troops, Preechr.

[Anonymous]

Originally Posted by Ant10708

The same reason we don't show pictures like these is the same reason we don't show pictures of abortions on broadcast TV. People don't like to see the bad side of what they support.

Haha, what. Maybe if we were invading the set of Rugrats in an effort to save them from the malevolent Reptar.

You could easily just counter the effect of these pictures by showing the hostage videos of many of the people executed in Falluja because we allowed it to become a base for our enemies.

Which wouldn't be happening if we weren't there in the first place, right? Which would be the point of the pictures I posted, right? Which would make you an idiot, right?

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Maybe pictures of Iraqi prisons before we invaded would carry some effect, too.....unfortunately, Saddam Hussein never liked cameras and thinks that create transparency.

As for the beheadings and the kidnappings......they couldn't happen because it wasn't as easy for foreign aid workers, private contractors, and other folks to walk around in Iraq. I'm not so sure Saddam Hussein would've been cool with that.

A lot of these kidnappers are from Jordan, Syria, Iran, and wherever else in the middle east. They couldn't pull this shit in Iraq prior to the war because Saddam would've killed their asses, and probably their families and pets, too. So we topple a dictator, and "occupy" their land, and now these assfaces can run crazy with swords and shit. Sorry, but I see no moral equivalence between what we're doing there, and what they're doing there.....

[Ant10708]

Originally Posted by Chojin

Haha, what. Maybe if we were invading the set of Rugrats in an effort to save them from the malevolent Reptar.

Which wouldn't be happening if we weren't there in the first place, right? Which would be the point of the pictures I posted, right? Which would make you an idiot, right?

I thought the pictures were about Faulluja not the entire war in Iraq.

[Ant10708]

I would still bet more innocent people were killed under Saddam's rule then the current chaos in Iraq. I could be wrong and I could care less.

[Anonymous]

That's a good American.

You get a biscuit, too, if you voted W.

[Dole]

I could be wrong and I could care less.

USA! USA!

[davinxtk]

The most offensive part of any of those pictures, to me, is that some jackass at getty images decided to watermark some of them so that they can't be used elsewhere.

'OUR PICTURES OF WAR ATROCITIES. NOT YOURS. OURS.'

That made me want to throw up. The atrocities I can deal with, but only because I've seen similar pictures hundreds of times over. It's the fact that they're so territorial about that sort of subject matter that makes me want to lose my lunch.

[Ronnie Raygun]

"As with all things violent and essentially unjustifiable: our tax dollars at work." - Preech

More than you know.....now that it's been discovered that our tax dollars are being used to fund the insurgency in Iraq thanks to our "allies" including good ole' Kofi at he U.N. ... and now they are trying to take a page out of Clinton's playbook and block the investigation so we can't find out which individuals are responsible.

If those pics are a surprise to some of you I wouldn't be shocked....Keep in mind that many many many more innocents died in wars before the "USA USA USA" decided to invest billions in smart weapons to minimize innocent casualties.

When is the last time any of you pointed to the good things happening in Iraq...Like the fact that 14 of the 18 different sections of Iraq are ready to hold elections TODAY.

[Ant10708]

How is Iraq split up into 18 sections? Cities?

[davinxtk]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Raygun

If those pics are a surprise to some of you I wouldn't be shocked....Keep in mind that many many many more innocents died in wars before the "USA USA USA" decided to invest billions in smart weapons to minimize innocent casualties.

When is the last time any of you pointed to the good things happening in Iraq...Like the fact that 14 of the 18 different sections of Iraq are ready to hold elections TODAY.

I'm sorry, if anything today's explosives are more powerful and wreckless than ever before. I don't know how you could even begin to hint otherwise. If you really think we're minimizing civilian casualties, then you're exactly what the government wants. Just another American who'll believe what he's told.

And you know, it might be something to boast about if 14 of the 18 different sections of Iraq were consistently ready to hold elections -- but isn't this thread about losing control in one part while we try to control another? Does anyone else get a picture of Dondald Duck sticking every possible digit into a brand new hole on a leaking rowboat? And when we run out of American bodies to cover the holes with, what next? Does the place sink on its own, or do we flip out Donald Duck-style and smash the thing entirely, only to end up sinking ourselves?

Also, don't you remember what happened in Afghanistan? Didn't everyone except the candidate with strong ties to our own government claim that their election was a farce? I mean, I know sand ******s can barely tell which end of the rocket launcher to point towards the enemy, but you'd think they'd be able to figure out which marker was permanent and which washed off on their own.


Ronnie "Mission Accomplished!" Raygun.
Ronnie "MY FINGERS ARE IN MY EARS LALALALALALA" Raygun.






Also, could someone else explain to him why the UN might be funding the insurgency? You know, since they told us we shouldn't be there in the first place and all, you'd think they'd be backing us up right now. Right guys? USA!? USA!

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Raygun

"As with all things violent and essentially unjustifiable: our tax dollars at work." - Preech

More than you know.....now that it's been discovered that our tax dollars are being used to fund the insurgency in Iraq thanks to our "allies" including good ole' Kofi at he U.N. ... and now they are trying to take a page out of Clinton's playbook and block the investigation so we can't find out which individuals are responsible.

Hmmmm........what?

If those pics are a surprise to some of you I wouldn't be shocked....Keep in mind that many many many more innocents died in wars before the "USA USA USA" decided to invest billions in smart weapons to minimize innocent casualties.

I don't know that this really matters, since a lot of the 3,000+ civilian casualties in Iraq have come from bombings, and they weren't necessarily all that "smart."

When is the last time any of you pointed to the good things happening in Iraq...Like the fact that 14 of the 18 different sections of Iraq are ready to hold elections TODAY.

47 political parties have announced a boycott of the election, and just yesterday, a senior aid to Prime Minister Allawai predicted that the elections may not happen in January (let alone TODAY).

The reason we talk about the problems is because the problems are crucial. It's great that Iraq has the "promise" of a free society now, but that's not why we were misled over there, was it Ronnie?

The reason the negative must be focused on is because liars like yourself, who listen to Rush Limbaugh and worship Sean Hannity, will lie, exaggerate, and mislead your fellow Americans every chance you get if it means you can advance your Party agenda. You did it in the build up to war, you've done it during the war, and you'll continue to do it. That's why.

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore

The reason the negative must be focused on is because liars like yourself, who listen to Rush Limbaugh and worship Sean Hannity, will lie, exaggerate, and mislead your fellow Americans every chance you get if it means you can advance your Party agenda. You did it in the build up to war, you've done it during the war, and you'll continue to do it. That's why.

Excellent point Kevin, and on that note, what happened to be the headline on Rushlimbaugh.com two days ago.....?

"Kofi Annan Screwing UN Like Clinton Screwed His Party"

Ronnie Raygun: "...thanks to our "allies" including good ole' Kofi at he U.N. ... and now they are trying to take a page out of Clinton's playbook and block the investigation so we can't find out which individuals are responsible."

Do we see the language association here, folks? Do we wanna believe that Ronnie was clever enough, all by himself, to turn a UN internal investigation into a shot at Bill Clinton? Don't bank on it.....

[davinxtk]

This might be an incredibly stupid question, but how did Clinton screw the Democrats over?
Am I missing something?

[Ant10708]

Originally Posted by davinxtk

Also, don't you remember what happened in Afghanistan? Didn't everyone except the candidate with strong ties to our own government claim that their election was a farce? I mean, I know sand ******s can barely tell which end of the rocket launcher to point towards the enemy, but you'd think they'd be able to figure out which marker was permanent and which washed off on their own.




Also, could someone else explain to him why the UN might be funding the insurgency? You know, since they told us we shouldn't be there in the first place and all, you'd think they'd be backing us up right now. Right guys? USA!? USA!

The marker thing turned out to be a mistake on the part of international election officials. But all the other candidiates have agreed to accept results because the UN said they would do an investiagtion to check for voter fraud.