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  #51  
kahljorn kahljorn is offline
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Old Nov 10th, 2005, 07:50 PM       
the reason I make the comparison between churchs and cults is because I've met cultists, they have a bit of crazy in their eyes and they believe nonsense. Whether it's political or religious nonsense, they somehow manage to grasp onto it no matter how ridiculous it is and believe it. I think it's because they have such a personal connection with it, it all seems to make them feel special; like they are a part of something important by obeying some crazy idea(the attraction i think is how 'complete' it is, like a 101 ways to get to heaven type thing.. the wholesome and successful by God's will feeling is probably what drives them).
That's why I think politics and religion should stay seperate, to keep that "Special" feeling away. That association with a life-style of perfection(politically, religiously, spiritually, morally and physically). Personally, I find religious stupors much more comfortable than enlightened obsession in those cases. I actually find religion to be quite successful in the fact that while it may create dogmatists, it rarily creates a full-blown zealot.

this one lady i met who was an ex-cultist was nuts. She's obsessed with my girlfriend and stalked her, including getting a job at the same place as her and going to her favorite bars. She was apparantly now some kind of S&M freak instead of a cultist, and would tie herself up next to my girlfriend in social situations so she'd dominate her or something. Scary
Which brings up another point: People who practice S&M(for the most part) are disgusting sick motherfuckers, and if being tied up alot can create those kinds of personalities and attract crazy ass cultists than I fear it. Avoid it like the plague, their 'community' is disgusting. Filled with the seven sins.
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Royal Tenenbaum Royal Tenenbaum is offline
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Old Nov 11th, 2005, 12:22 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Blanco
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Originally Posted by Royal Tenenbaum
"White men. "

yeah, no, you're retarded. it was in fact written by jews and potentially arabs. the bible was later edited into what it is by white men in the catholic church, but almost none of the bible, if not none of it, was written by "whites." jesus wasn't white either. fuck people are stupid.
psst. King James wasn't Catholic.
psst. He just edited a version of the Bible. The New Testament existed long before he did, and the Catholic Church had a hand in it.
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Old Nov 11th, 2005, 03:11 PM       
All the books of the NT were written by individuals. What the Catholic Church did was sort through a huge collection of books and decided which ones were canonical.
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Old Nov 12th, 2005, 10:59 AM       
For our own good, of course.

Keep drinkin' the kool-aid, people.
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Old Nov 12th, 2005, 01:20 PM       
It was Flavor-Aid. Geez.
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Royal Tenenbaum Royal Tenenbaum is offline
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Old Nov 12th, 2005, 03:24 PM       
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Originally Posted by Sethomas
All the books of the NT were written by individuals. What the Catholic Church did was sort through a huge collection of books and decided which ones were canonical.
That was my point. Shouldn't the fact God wrote all those books through people make them all canonical? No, becuase religion is a stupid shame.
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Old Nov 12th, 2005, 03:34 PM       
It's a good thing we have Royal here to clarify things for us. Hey, what's your take on peace in the Middle East? How about ending poverty? The world needs you, man!
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Old Nov 12th, 2005, 06:56 PM       
I think Royal is okay. You just need to ignore some of the dumb things he says, much like how you would do with most people you know.
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Old Nov 13th, 2005, 02:34 AM       
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You just need to ignore some of the dumb things he says, much like how you would do with most people you know.
I for one never ignore dumb things anyone I know says.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sethomas
All the books of the NT were written by individuals. What the Catholic Church did was sort through a huge collection of books and decided which ones were canonical.
That was my point. Shouldn't the fact God wrote all those books through people make them all canonical? No, becuase religion is a stupid shame.
If God saw to it that the books were written, I think the argument would go that he wouldn't let them go uncanonized, or allow some other nonsense to be written in His name.
What a shame that there are so many other supposedly canonical writings of other religions, all written in the name of God. Although other then the Koran, there aren't really alot that aren't widely considered to be crazy.
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Old Nov 13th, 2005, 04:49 AM       
I guess I worded that very badly.

Let's pretend I just said "You just have to ignore some of the stupid things he says."
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Old Nov 14th, 2005, 06:13 PM       
"Hey, what's your take on peace in the Middle East? How about ending poverty?"

Easy. Cut taxes. And cut taxes.
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kahljorn kahljorn is offline
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Old Nov 15th, 2005, 11:21 AM       
The sad thing about this topic is that the seperation of church failed, and they are coddling eachother lovingly. There's plenty of this around(marriage laws) and if you look at the election process you can see a few more bouts of pre-marital sex.
During the election process you are generally bound to see two extremely religious people(and I use that brief description with as much infelicity as possible) facing eachother, one saying the other's not religious because he supports unreligious things, and another supporting them to impress people.
You're also bound to see media coverage of one of them being ousted by the church. How will this effect elections? Why should it under seperation of church and state?

And as a brief side-note: The occurance of these things may arise because of democracy. In it's very nature the Government is the 'people', even if they are a bunch of delusional religious nuts. The nature of the world seems to latch onto religion in it's natural state.
Which makes you wonder, how much progress has humanity really made that it's still in a delusional fixation?
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Old Nov 15th, 2005, 12:03 PM       
"The nature of the world seems to latch onto religion in it's natural state. "

That's because people are weak. They will grab onto whatever fairy tales make them feel better and quell the pain of reality.
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Old Nov 15th, 2005, 01:28 PM       
I guess so. The more you involve politics into the matter, the more debased it gets.
Also, I might add, religion is actually a good thing. It's just not practiced.
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 01:21 AM       
Seperation of church and state is incoherent anyway, since liberalism and rationality are just as much religions as religions are.
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 10:45 AM       
I don't think religions are very religious at all, so I can see your point.
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 04:51 PM       
This thread has reached am impass. Who amongst you can save it?!
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 05:21 PM       
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Originally Posted by kahljorn
I don't think religions are very religious at all, so I can see your point.
to me, "religion" signifies more the rules and rituals associated with belief in a higher power, so religions are very religious. and i suppose what you are referring to, i would call "spiritual."
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 05:36 PM       
comfort in dogma?
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 05:40 PM       
just saying.
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kahljorn kahljorn is offline
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 05:54 PM       
When was the last time you saw a christian loving everybody, or giving a helping hand like jesus would? Remember, the word christian means "Christ-like". What more is there? If religion is a lifestyle, the lifestyles are clearly bullshit, underlined by the fact that they don't generally follow their religion.
However, I'm only talking about western religion. I really can't formulate an opinion on the lifestyles of muslims or jews, though the few muslims I've met were awesome.

*edit* I just want to emphacize that I'm talking mostly about western religion.
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 06:01 PM       
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Originally Posted by kahljorn
When was the last time you saw a christian loving everybody, or giving a helping hand like jesus would?
yesterday.


Quote:
Remember, the word christian means "Christ-like". What more is there? If religion is a lifestyle, the lifestyles are clearly bullshit, underlined by the fact that they don't generally follow their religion.
You have an incredibly jaded and dogmatic view of Christians.
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 06:01 PM       
What is your modern observations of "christians" lately:

People who are accepting, loving and "Christ-like".

or

Pious, close-minded, cliquey assholes who are as diametrically opposed to anything Christian values represent

in an ideal world, right?
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kahljorn kahljorn is offline
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 06:19 PM       
"yesterday. "

Maybe I should've said: When was the last time you saw Christianity as the mass religion it is dolling out help to mankind? What percentage of christianity do you think is christ like?

My views on christianity are jaded? I don't hate them or even have any dislike for them, I just happen to know that the lifestyle they are supposed to acheive isn't acheived by them in their lifetime(or even really strived for). If you want to argue that maybe we should continue this conversation in one of the iraq war threads.
Are you seriously arguing that all, or even a majority(even a handful), of christians are capable of living up to the standards they set for everyone else?
Besides, there's plenty of other ignorant western religions, and plenty of people in eastern countries that follow a religion but aren't religious. What is your definition of religious? Tea time with the Engles?
Religion is supposed to have some kind of purpose(if not, than what's the point?), and that purpose isn't supposed to be to destroy and spite everything around us(although I'm sure there's a few religions that teach that).
People acting like the church isn't corrupt is kind of funny though, kevin, I'll give you that. Also, thinking that the corrupt nature of the church and Worshipping god are somehow the same practice is inherently flawed and pointless. Maybe being religious is being a corrupt asshole who can throw entire countries into a rage just by saying some other country doubts their belief? That's a great quality to strive to and hold to be true to god's name!

If you want to turn this into a cultural debate and argue what role, if any, religion serves(under god of course) and if religion(or christianity) is achieving that role, let's do it.
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Old Nov 16th, 2005, 06:26 PM       
You described a "Christ-like" act as "loving everybody, or giving a helping hand like jesus would."

Do you think Christians across this country, every day, don't spend countless hours helping the homeless, the poor, and hte needy?

" If religion is a lifestyle, the lifestyles are clearly bullshit, underlined by the fact that they don't generally follow their religion."

What would qualify as compliance with one's religion? Are you sure it isn't your definition rather than the Bible's???
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