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Geggy Geggy is offline
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Old Dec 25th, 2005, 10:13 PM        Israel and US's NSA connection
Thought this was an interesting read...

NSA Snooping And
Israeli Connection Questioned
Year Ends With NSA Snooping Issue while Reader Questions
New York Times Censorship And Biased Reporting, Relating
It To Protecting And Favoring Israeli Interests
Over U.S. And The Rest Of The World

Dr. Mohamed Khodr writes letter to New York Times that hasn't been published, raising questions as to fair and honest coverage. Is the Times protecting Israeli interests to the detrimnet of America, leading to censorship of important stories like the motives behind the Iraqi War, 9/11, the Patriot Act and NSA snooping on Americans.

By Greg Szymanski
12-25-5

The year is ending with a flurry of concern over President Bush's direct order to spy on Americans, using the Pentagon and National Security Agency (NSA) spooks to ration out the government's dirty work on mostly innocent and unsuspecting Americans.

The story recently broke in the mainstream press as the heated debate to renew the highly controversial Patriot Act took center stage in the Senate, ending last Friday as lawmakers agreed to a Feb 3, 2006, extension before any real action is taken.

For years, critics of the Patriot Act have been screaming about its direct infringement on cherished constitutional privacy and speech rights, but without much luck in getting any significant changes.

In fact, the NSA snooping story is directly related to the Patriot Act's illegality since it gives spooks an unbridled power to wiretap and eavesdrop on "suspected domestic terrorists," using mere suspicion, without a warrant, as the legal thresh hold instead of showing probable cause a crime is being committed.

Relaxing the legal standard from probable cause to mere suspicion has most fair-minded legal scholars up in arms. But academia provides little consolation for the millions of Americans now living under the umbrella of a fascist state, since newspaper follow-up reports recently pointed out the 18,000 people on the Bush spy list in the recent NSA story is only the "tip of the iceberg."

The extent and sheer numbers of those being spied on by the NSA without court-approved warrants based on probable cause ? not mere suspicion ? is now thought to be much, much larger.

And even The New York Times, who sat on the story for 18 months as a favor to the Bush administration, reported this fact in a Saturday follow-up to the original NBC story.

However, media critics complain both new agencies are out to lunch and "a day late and a dollar short" with their reporting efforts since widespread NSA and Pentagon abuse, with White House acknowledgement, has been documented by the alternative press and civil rights activists as early as 2002.

In fact, after the Times was caught red-handed in suppressing the NSA snooping story for more than 18 months, it provided just another example of the many stories, including 9/11 and the motives behind the war in Iraq, suppressed by Times management.

The year-end question arises: Why?

Many critics contend the Times is protecting the Bush administration and its neo-con world order agenda. Others also contend its policies favor and protect Israeli interests while turning a blind-eye to the U.S. and the rest of the world.

But knowing the Bush administration will step up efforts in 2006 to spy on more Americans and the Times will continue to censor even more important stories, let's end this year with a letter sent to the New York Times, sent by Mohamed Khodr, MD, which never was published but illustrated what Dr. Khodr feels is a "deep Israeli bias" resulting in the censorship of many important stories, including the truth behind the war in Iraq, 9/11, the Patriot Act, the NSA snooping story and many others.

In an effort to hear all views, the following is the unedited letter sent by Dr. Khodr to the publisher of the Times, Arthur Sulzberger, but not yet published:

Dear Mr. Sulzberger:
Happy Hanukah:
"Just a brief note to reiterate what I've written you on several occasions, written your editors including your letter editor, that your paper is unable to shake the influence and hold whether ideological, financial, political or just pure fear of confrontation of a Pro-Israel bias that has severely damaged the credibility of your paper. The once glorious paper of record has now come a timid infotainment paper that knows where its bread is buttered, and its not from any sense of justice or fairness it once embodied.

"Your paper's scandals, Pro-Israel and Pro-Iraq War will continue to bleed your credibility as the wars have bled the blood of the innocent youth of America, Iraq, Palestine, and Israel. Your support of Israel in the long run is a losing proposition and will only further alienate Americans and the world not only from Israel but from the future peace and stability of Jewish grandchildren who may pay a burdensome price for what you and the Zionist cabals have done to destroy this nation and the future of peace in the MidEast. "Never Again" should be the standard for the suffering of all humans not just for Jews who suffered expulsions from every European country and principality, an Inquisition, pogroms, hate, persecution, murders, and finally a Holocaust at the hands of Europe, not in Muslim countries and certainly not in Palestine. It was Islam that took Jewish refugees in and protected them, in fact placed them in honorable governmnet positions, as was the case of RamBam (for your letter editor's sake: that's Moses Maimonedes).

"Unfortunately your editor is of a lightweight intellect doing his "kosher" duty rather than seeking enlightenment on Zionism and Israel's history. I'm sure he's not read any part of the Babylonian Talmud nor of any United Nations report on Israel's terrorism --The Bunche Report to better understand why most Europeans think Israel is the main threat to world peace. Keeping such knowledge out of your paper will only further allow the Internet to exponentially expose the machinations of the media's silence when non-kosher blood is spilled as was the case when your front page plastered a huge photo of a suicide bomber's aftermath of an exploding bus with a young Israeli girl dead at the window.

"I've lived through the hell of Sharon's cluster bombs, napalm, and white phosphours bombs along with asphyxiating unknown chemical gas in 1982 Beirut, his raiding ofhospitals to take the wounded out and kill them, his destruction of entire buildings based on a "rumo" that Arafat maybe in it, his cutting off ofwater, food, and medicines fromentire cities and villages, his supportive massacre for 3 days of 2000 Palestinian civilians in two refugee camps------I don't see Bill Keller clamoring for the paper to publish a photo of such murders today for a historical context of Palestinian dead.Incidentally, the United Nations Security Council (with U.S. support) passed several Resolutions just during the summer of 1982 "urging" Israel to withdraw, stop the massacred, and allow food, water, and medicines into Beirut, but as usual Israel can tell the world to go to hell for all it cares.
Compare that with one U.N. Security Council Resolution against Syria to withdraw from Lebanon which it did, thus it seems the U.N. implements Israel's wishes but is impotent to even tell Israel "NO".

"I see your paper took issue with the Congress cutting $40 Billion of spending from America's poor over the next five years. Given that's about $8 Billion a year from America's children, your paper "forgot" to mentionthat this amount is what Israel receives almost annually from the American taxpayer when all funding from so many hidden "amendments" in the federal budget is accounted for. So Congress and your paper obviously support starving America's children but more than willing to pay for Israel's illegal squatters to leave their U.S. subsidized homes from Gaza.

"Thus the question here is: Who decides America's priorities? It's obviously not the silent majority of Americans who are kept in the dark by the media, such as yours, as to who's alienating this grand nation from the world and why are its children paying for the benefit of a rich nation, Israel, the 16th richest nations in the world and a nation who takes America's taxes and gives loans to other governments and entities, thus reaping aid and interest from the American taxpayer who can't pay for his or her drugs.

"Perhaps your editors can answer this simple question: what conference was held in 1949 in Europe on the Palestinian issue and what was its result?

"It's tragic that you as the publisher worry more about your bottom line than about the foundation of peace for Israel. Your hiring of such a biased editor who publishes TWO letters supporting Israel---to be fair he doesn't dare deny an Israeli counsel or an Abe Foxman letter which are published on an auto-pilot basis---and only ONE letter supporting Palestinian democracy is an outrage and a slap to the face of the editorial page, especially a page that helped launch a war based on known lies. America was pushed into war by your paper and others, by MILLER, LIBBY, PERLE, WOLFOWITZ, FEITH, ZAKHEIM, ABRAMS et. al---none of whom are Arabs or Muslims.

"Do remove the "all the news that FIT to print". It's hypocritical and unbecoming given that men like your letter editor decide what's "FIT" to print. Obviously your public editor whom I've written on several occasions is unable to deal with this issue or is supportive of the letter editor's bias.

Human beings are dying overseas while you and your staff enjoy your peaceful and well paid life. As I've told you previously, your Grandfather was an "Anti-Zionist" who loathed the pressure placed on him by the Zionists.

Happy Hanukah and Merry Christmas to your Editors and Staff.Mohamed Khodr M.D.

http://www.rense.com/general69/nsan.htm
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Old Dec 26th, 2005, 12:12 AM       
Rense.com ???? Geggy, I'm not sure why this excites you so much.

Jeff Rense is fixated on demonizing Jews. He believes in the Protocols of Zion, the text most cited as proof of a Jewish conspiracy to control the world. That is probably the #1 conspiracy theory attributed to Jews, and the foundation for the belief that Jews are greedy, power hungry people. Many Jews have died as a result of that text, which only nutcakes embrace as legit at this point.

Shame on you. Really. It's not comical that you keep using these type of recourses...it's just cliche and lazy.

Why would the NY Times publish a letter which speaks again of Jewish cabals, and rewrites history to say Islamic nations took in Jews during the Holocaust, when in fact that is false? 900,000+ Jews lost their citizenship, and had their assets frozen, and that is an absolute truth. Even the British restricted visas into their collonized Middle Eastern territory. Rejecting that type of garbage doesn't require anyone to do their "kosher duty" as that letter claims.
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Old Dec 27th, 2005, 11:08 AM       
I don't trust Rense.com at all, especially with their kooky UFO and 9/11 conspiracy theories but they do provide several good articles there. The person who wrote the article is one of the few independent journalists that I can trust the most...

Like I said in another thread...there are a lot of disinformationlists in the 9/11 truth movement and Rense.com is one of them...

I think a lot of people are questioning the manipulation of the numbers of jewish people who were killed in the holocaust. They've claimed that 6 miliion jews were killed which is impossible because it's already been proven that only 2.5 million jews existed in the area at the time...
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Old Dec 27th, 2005, 11:10 AM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geggy
I don't trust Rense.com at all, especially with their kooky UFO and 9/11 conspiracy theories
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Old Dec 27th, 2005, 04:04 PM       
I point out some deliberately false information in your article (that Islamic nations embraced Holocaust refugees with open arms) and rather then respond to that, you come back denying the Holocaust numbers even happened. Maybe they're using the same numerical scale that told you only 1 Jew died in the WTC attacks?

Really, what do you want us to do with that?
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Old Dec 27th, 2005, 06:32 PM       
I think you missed the point...how do I put this delicately...hmm...aww fuck it...ZIONISTS HAVE BEEN LYING TO YOU AS LONG AS IT EVER EXISTED.
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Old Dec 27th, 2005, 07:21 PM       
Which Zionists?

The Socialist worker Zionists? The Pan-Arab Zionists? The Christian Zionists? The Marxist ones? The Zionists born and raised in the Middle East? The Zionists who believe in a Jewish homeland, but not inside Israel?

Zionism as an ideology has existed as long as there's been a Jewish Diaspora.....so what do you think they lied about ?

The desire for self determination? The Holocaust?
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Old Dec 27th, 2005, 09:36 PM       
Only 2.5 million Jews lived in the areas in and around Germany during WW2? where do you get your facts
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Old Dec 28th, 2005, 05:08 PM       
There are currently 1.5 million Jews in Europe.

Once you do the math, the 2.5 million number is another way of saying the Holocaust didn't happen - at all.
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Old Dec 28th, 2005, 10:49 PM       
Which one in the list is the zionists of undrground iraq who pushed the palestines into the land of islam? The zionists who tried to pull the arab jews from the land of islam into israel? Maybe they had lied about everything regarding the history of middle east and the arabs?

It's funny if you think about it. Zionist was allied with hitler and germany in ww2. Now it looks to me that the US is currently allied with the Zionists...is history repeating itself???
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 06:18 AM       
You're insane.

I can tell you that my Iraqi family went to Israel with the Communist party, not with any Zionist organizations...

They left behind a Babylonian culture that predates any notion of a "land of islam" because Jews were being targeted and outlawed.
The wealthier Jews in my family went to Sweden, England, and the US.

Got any more garblygoop non-sequitor accusations ?
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 07:24 AM       
Insane? Not according to what I've read. Why is everything to you is so one sided?

The info I got was from this article...it took me a while to find this article because I've saved shitloads of articles similiar to this one. I usually rely on info from the people who LIVED through it...like this iraqi jew who LIVED through it...

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/zi.../iraqijews.cfm
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 10:04 AM       
Geggy, the things you read are either made-up by crazed anti-semites or twisted around by crazed anti-semites. And maybe some regular conspiracy theorists. Really, it doesn't matter.

The thing is, your proof, and these articles, it's all bull. Maybe not all, but most of it is.

There is no international Jewish conspiracy. The holocaust happened. It really, really did. Six million jews were killed.

Really, Geggy, you need medication, or therapy of some kind. Your rants can't be the product of a healthy mind.
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 11:23 AM       
You mean I'm insane or does it all sound insane to you?

I'm just gonna post this link here and you decide for yourself...

http://www.iamthewitness.com/DarylBr...th_Prepare.htm
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 11:33 AM       
I mean you are insane.
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 12:33 PM       
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Originally Posted by Geggy
I think a lot of people are questioning the manipulation of the numbers of jewish people who were killed in the holocaust. They've claimed that 6 miliion jews were killed which is impossible because it's already been proven that only 2.5 million jews existed in the area at the time...
Which "area" are you talking about? Germany?

I can't believe you're a Holocaust revisionist. Here I thought you were an okay guy.
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 12:33 PM       
That link was hilarious, Geggy, thanks.
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 12:42 PM       
I think you're confusing insanity to real fucking pissed off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spectre X
Geggy, the things you read are either made-up by crazed anti-semites or twisted around by crazed anti-semites. And maybe some regular conspiracy theorists. Really, it doesn't matter.
Oooh look who's turning into a conspiracy theorist!
Quote:
The thing is, your proof, and these articles, it's all bull. Maybe not all, but most of it is.
What if it's not bull...?

Quote:
There is no international Jewish conspiracy. The holocaust happened. It really, really did. Six million jews were killed.
I agree, holocaust really did happened but how many were really killed? It's sick and absurd of the Zionists to have possibly manipulated the numbers for their own advantage.

Quote:
Really, Geggy, you need medication, or therapy of some kind. Your rants can't be the product of a healthy mind.
Pat robertson says "thank you" for making me sound insane.
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 12:51 PM       
Quote:
For example, Pat Robertson considers himself to be a "Christian Zionist". He not only supports everything done in the name of Israel, but he also considers "anti-Zionism" to be a bad thing, as he announced in this speech to Israelis:


"Let us serve our God together by opposing the virulent poison of anti-Semitism and anti-Zionism that is rapidly engulfing the world."


Pat Robertson's remark is as ridiculous as somebody saying:

Let us serve our God together by opposing anti-Semitism and car theft.

What does anti-Semitism have to do with car theft? The answer is nothing. And what does anti-Semitism have to do with anti-Zionism? The answer is nothing.
HOW RIDICULOUS BOLDFACE BOLDFACE. They, uh, are related. I think you'll find that most people that hate blacks also hate rap music. AND WHAT IF A JEWISH GUY'S CAR WAS STOLEN, HUH. YOUR HOUSE OF CARDS HAS COLLAPSED.

I'm more liberal than thou and I know better than to trust morons that think you need to use text formatting to make a point. These people are just deficient human beings trying to rationalize their bullshit prejudices.
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 02:06 PM       
Chojin, I'm not sure if i understand the point you're trying to make...he's comparing a car theft to anti-semite as if they aren't even related to one and another as are anti-zionist and anti-semite. Because the people are constantly accusing anti-zionists for being anti-semite, he's just pointing out the zionists' tactics to mix up anti-zionist and anti-semite together to make people think anti-zionists are disrespectful towards the jews in majority and shouldn't be taken seriously...I don't see how's that moronic??? Or are you just jumping in the bandwagon??

I don't consider myself a liberal at all. I guess I'm more of an independent and I'm against the people for their idiocy and wrongdoings, whether they're liberal or conversative.
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 04:16 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geggy
I think you're confusing insanity to real fucking pissed off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spectre X
Geggy, the things you read are either made-up by crazed anti-semites or twisted around by crazed anti-semites. And maybe some regular conspiracy theorists. Really, it doesn't matter.
Oooh look who's turning into a conspiracy theorist!
There's no conspiracy. Just a bunch of assholes that read each other's stuff and pretend there is.

And I'm not confusing anything with anything. You sound like a crazy person. Get help.

EDIT: You know, you remind me of the Spathi from Star Control. You come across as someone who believes that the proof of a conspiracy is the fact that it's covered up so well that nobody can find any real evidence towards it.
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Old Dec 29th, 2005, 05:02 PM       
Sorry buster - You left the boundries of being an Anti-Zionist, and started sounding outright anti-Jewish a while ago. As I've said here a billion times, Zionism in the context you're using it has become a safe word for "a cabal of bad evil corrupt Jews". Your "Anti-Zionism" theories are IDENTICAL to the blood libels which define Anti-Semitism.

re: Iraq. I was eligable to vote in Iraq's election. Let's just say I've known a few people who lived through it, aight?
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Old Dec 30th, 2005, 06:06 AM       
All I'm saying is anti-semitism is hatred of jews and anti-zionism is opposition to zionism and israeli policies. Would the term "opposition to zionism" sound better to you? Zionism is a group of ideologists like the nazi social movement, the black panthers and the overthrows only zionism is more acceptable to the political system and the society, not so much who are opposed to it. That's just the way I see it.

Just wondering why would the people write fictional stories in order to express their "opposition to zionism"? Is it a piece of propaganda created by islamic and the orthodox jews in hopes to form a large group of zionist opposers to bring down the zionists? If it's all really bull, I'll have to admit I was bit fooled by it.

I apologize for behaving like a holocaust denier...I have the tendency to question everything. 6 million sounds like an exaggeration.
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Old Dec 30th, 2005, 10:45 AM       
Geggy, the point you keep missing (and one I once failed to grasp) is that you are targeting certain "ideologists" within a movement that is terribly difficult to label or marginalize. I think you say zionist much the way we here in America say "neo-con," like it's one consistent ideology that a bunch of intellectuals decided to cook up and start think-tanks over.

I'm not arguing that Zionism is lacking in those things, but unlike neo-conservatism, it can't be so easily defined in that manner.
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Old Dec 30th, 2005, 10:54 AM       
I'll repeat myself - Your "Anti-Zionism" theories are IDENTICAL to the blood libels which define Anti-Semitism.

Zionism just means you believe in the right of a self governed Jewish homeland. Nothing more, nothing less. It's another way to describe a type of patriotism formed around a diaspora, with the goal to RE-ESTABLISH Jewish soveriengty. That's it.

There will always be those who distort facts, and figure out a way in which to blame Jewish victims for the persecution they suffered, when targeted for no reason other then their Jewishness. ...and that's true wether we're talking about Cruxifictions, the Dreyfuss Affair, Pogroms in Russia, the Holocaust, the ethnic cleansing of Jews from Arab nations, or the Intifadas.
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