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Dec 6th, 2003 06:07 PM
mburbank Oh. That. I totally thought you were just kidding.
Dec 6th, 2003 04:04 PM
kellychaos
Quote:
Originally Posted by The One and Only...
Greater productivity does yield greater pay, it's just that it is more likely to do so when productivity generally increases over specifically.
Another indication that you've never worked in the labor field and probably why you always sound like a textbook when the topic is discussed. Theory's great but how about a day in the shoes, brother?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The One and Only...
The reason people cut corners, etc. is because we are lazy bastards. Haven't you noticed that, rather than working more, people work less when they are payed more?
I consider myself a moderate to (sometimes) hard worker but it's kind of hard to be inspired to work hard when "lazy bastards" don't do the work you do but are paid the same wage. I did the "work harder thing" when I was in the army. Do you know what it taught me? I learned that the people that work harder often get bigger workloads with more responsibility for the same pay and when it came to wanting to get job-related training away from my job, I was often turned down because other people couldn't handle my workload (or knew how I set up the things I did) while I was away. Long story short: Where's the my motivation?
Dec 6th, 2003 03:41 PM
The One and Only...
Quote:
Originally Posted by The One and Only...
Government is simply the combined effort of several interest groups to turn the interaction of humans in their favor. Most support unified military and police; therefore, few complain about the government stealing their money through taxation and having it allocated to such functions. However, differences in opinions lead to political lobbying and parties, and, after much deliberation, a consensus is reached to create a basic governmental framework that allows for policy to be changed without bloodshed. That is how a republic forms.
Dec 6th, 2003 02:11 PM
mburbank Did you explain what government is? I think I must have missed that.
Dec 6th, 2003 12:13 PM
AChimp OAO is full of shit, doo daa, doo daa...
Dec 6th, 2003 09:42 AM
Zhukov People cut corners for 101 different reasons, laziness included.

The biggest reason is alienation from ones company, boss or produce.



Quote:
That said, if a manager notices a worker who is particularly productive over a period of time, they might get a bonus.
In whos' fantasy land?
Dec 6th, 2003 09:23 AM
The One and Only... Didn't I already explain what the government is in this thread? Or, at least, in my opinion.

Greater productivity does yield greater pay, it's just that it is more likely to do so when productivity generally increases over specifically. That said, if a manager notices a worker who is particularly productive over a period of time, they might get a bonus.

The reason people cut corners, etc. is because we are lazy bastards. Haven't you noticed that, rather than working more, people work less when they are payed more?
Dec 6th, 2003 12:34 AM
Big Papa Goat
Quote:
I just disagree with the notion of societal contract
What do you think government is then?
Dec 5th, 2003 11:47 PM
Perndog Greater productivity does *not* equal greater pay, except in sales and other fields where workers get commissions. If it did, the nation would not be so full of slackers, cheaters, corner-cutters, and everyone else who does the bare minimum required to get their check.

In other words, the world would end.
Dec 5th, 2003 04:27 PM
kellychaos Reality is a mother-funkygroovitalizer!
Dec 5th, 2003 04:23 PM
AChimp AHAHAHAHA!!! LOOK AT HIM BACKPEDAL!!!!
Dec 5th, 2003 04:17 PM
kahljorn Women(who are capable) should definitley be allowed to do muscly work, like construction work(how often do you see a woman sandbagging). Just like any man who can cook, clean and give birth should be able to stay at home and be housewives.
Dec 5th, 2003 03:48 PM
The One and Only... I was speaking in general terms. Of course women who are better at their field deserve more pay.
Dec 5th, 2003 03:37 PM
kellychaos
Quote:
Originally Posted by The One and Only...
I'm out of middle school.

Think about it. Men are generally stronger; thus, they are more able to work certain bluecollar jobs over women. Hence, they are more productive, and greater productivity leads to higher pay.

That doesn't mean that the hiring company is sexist.
You OBVIOUSLY haven't worked in the labor industry. I've seem some women who can do all the physical work that most men can do. Granted, they look like offensive linemen but they're not getting paid for their looks. Now, if you were ammend your comment to state "equal pay for those who merit it", I'd buy into that.
Dec 5th, 2003 01:28 PM
AChimp OAO, if you ever graduate and make it through business school, you will see how wrong you are in every aspect.
Dec 5th, 2003 12:57 PM
The One and Only... I don't advocate the repeal of all environmental laws. In fact, I support the passage of a law that respects emission rights, the end of soviergn immunity, and tax credits for entrepeneurs that start up gaming ranches and wilderness reserves (I believed I already pointed out that they can actually increase biodiversity). I just think we need to seriously consider how and to what extent we protect the environment.

Only a fool would advocate the repeal of all regulation, no matter what the cost. I'm a libertarian, not some freaky market anarchist that hangs out in the basement all day.
Dec 5th, 2003 12:41 PM
mburbank So what about Government re you in favor of? Your Kidneys being protected from organ stealers? Cause I like my lungs being protected by a functional EPA.
Dec 5th, 2003 12:32 PM
The One and Only... Big men with guns will come and take you to prison.

Remember, I am in favor of government. I just disagree with the notion of societal contract and that actions made by government are any less morally apprehensable because they are done by the government. Taxation is still theft - it's just tolerated, or supported by the people.
Dec 5th, 2003 12:15 PM
mburbank Within each employers company.


Explain to me why in your societal theory Someone shouldn't kill you to sell your kidneys?
Dec 5th, 2003 12:05 PM
The One and Only...
Quote:
Originally Posted by mburbank
Extreme, I know, but my point is we all, even you, think there is a purpose to a social contract and government.
I don't believe in any sort of "social contract" theory. I believe in the government, but for different reasons.

Quote:
I absolutely think Equal pay for Equal time should be law.
Please elaborate on exactly what you mean. Within the same company? Over all companies? Over all jobs?

In any case, have fun with your labor theory of value and efficiency losses, as well as throwing several men into unescapeable debt.

Quote:
Government is our group effort to reinforce our better selves.
This is where we disagree. Government is simply the combined effort of several interest groups to turn the interaction of humans in their favor. Most support unified military and police; therefore, few complain about the government stealing their money through taxation and having it allocated to such functions. However, differences in opinions lead to political lobbying and parties, and, after much deliberation, a consensus is reached to create a basic governmental framework that allows for policy to be changed without bloodshed. That is how a republic forms.
Dec 5th, 2003 10:42 AM
mburbank Well, suppose someone wants to kill you and sell your organs. Should the government intervene there? Extreme, I know, but my point is we all, even you, think there is a purpose to a social contract and government. We all draw a line at what they should do. I absolutely think Equal pay for Equal time should be law. I absolutely belive that companies would keep slaves if they were allowed to, work people for only as much food as it took to keep them alive if they were allowed to, Kidnap and grind pople up for pet food if they were allowed to. I believe the strong would use the weak for carpets and a lot of this country would kill the poor if it was socially exceptable.

Government is our group effort to reinforce our better selves. What that means is open to debate, but I'm all in favor of the effort. I far rather rely on the efforts of a representative government with a series of check and balances built in than hope for the altruism of a free market.
Dec 4th, 2003 04:36 PM
The One and Only... I believe they will go away, but not thanks to government intervention.
Dec 4th, 2003 04:33 PM
Bennett you sometimes seem resigned to the fact that all of our problems will never go away... do you believe that to be true of yourself?
Dec 4th, 2003 04:29 PM
The One and Only... I know that. I just disagree with the notion that a blanket regulation will make all our problems go away.
Dec 4th, 2003 04:28 PM
Bennett Women get less pay at office jobs, not just at the steel mill.
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