Minutemen border patrol

[AngPur]

Originally Posted by El Blanco

1) Maddox is a hack.

That doesn't mean he's incorrect on this. Try looking up what an 'ad hominem attack' is.

Originally Posted by El Blanco

2) Are you telling me we don't spend billions on services and enforcement on illegal aliens?

Are you telling me they do rob you of jobs?

Originally Posted by El Blanco

3) Do you know what racist means?

Prejudice or prejudiced actions based on race. Many understand that racial profiling on, say, the highway is indeed racism, despite the fact that the offenders are still breaking the law. Sound familiar?

That's not to say I'm calling them racist. I'm calling you racist. You seem to associate illegal aliens with Mexicans, who apparently are raising your taxes and bringing drugs and crime into America.

Many illegal aliens, though, are not Mexicans. That's not to comment on percentages, granted, but still. If you want to keep José out because his being here illegaly irks you, fine. If you don't care about the Russian guy whose student visa just ran out though, it seems like you have something against Mexicans.

Originally Posted by El Blanco

4) Oops, you're a retard.

Gadzooks! I've been called a retard on the internet? How can I ever defend myself from my witty, intellectual superior?

Originally Posted by El Blanco

Because this how they are spending their free time. Its not their livelyhood.

Then I'm going to give the credit for any arrests to the professionals. It's not bad that these guys are nosey citizens, but likewise it's hardly commendable.

Originally Posted by El Blanco

Why don't you bother Max or Kevin on why they don't become professional activists?

HUR HUR I'm going to deflect this guy's attention by mentioning two other forumers I disagree with! HUR HUR

Originally Posted by thebiggameover

AngPur- have you ever been here to arizona?

Have you ever been to Turkey? What the hell does location matter? Are you asking me if I know what a Mexican is? Yes, we have them in other states too, believe it or not.

[Ant10708]

I'm studying to be an accountant so honestly the last thing I'm worried about is an illegal immigrant stealing my job.

[Carnivore]

Why should people who take the time and effort to legally immigrate to the United States be treated the same as people who feloniously jump the border? Isn't that unfair to the people who do it the right way?

Why don't all the Minutemen become Border Patrol officers? Because they'd have to be paid for that. They're volunteering time to assist paid officers. Maybe if they diverted some funds from programs that benefit illegals they could expand the Border Patrol, though. There's an idea!

[El Blanco]

Originally Posted by AngPur

That doesn't mean he's incorrect on this. Try looking up what an 'ad hominem attack' is.

It certainly doesn't make him any type of authority on the subject. In fact, you tried to appeal to some outside authority( another ed herring in debating) as if it would make a difference in the argument. You even tried to throw out the "r" word as if I'm going to back off, even though it just doesn't apply here.

Are you telling me they do rob you of jobs?

I'm looking....looking.....looking....nope I never said that.

Prejudice or prejudiced actions based on race.

I'm basing my arguments based on actions not race.

Many understand that racial profiling on, say, the highway is indeed racism, despite the fact that the offenders are still breaking the law. Sound familiar?

Sure, but there is a huge difference in stopping a car full of black guys because they are black and stopping people coming from Mexico because they are jumping the border illegally.

That's not to say I'm calling them racist. I'm calling you racist.

And I'm calling you a moron.

You seem to associate illegal aliens with Mexicans, who apparently are raising your taxes and bringing drugs and crime into America.

Wow, that is completly not what I said.

Did I say all illegal immigrants are Mexican? No

Did I say all people here from Mexican families are illegal aliens? No

What did I say?

I said that there is a huge problem with illegal aliens along the Mexican border. Are you denying this?

I said that the Mexican border is also a big access point for guns narcotics etc etc. This is also a fact.

Many illegal aliens, though, are not Mexicans.

No shit. There are Chinese illegals, Irish illegals Russian illegals etc etc etc

That's not to comment on percentages, granted, but still.

So you are saying the majority of illagal immigrants are Mexican? Oops, you're a reacist....and still a retard.

If you want to keep José out because his being here illegaly irks you, fine. If you don't care about the Russian guy whose student visa just ran out though, it seems like you have something against Mexicans.

When did I say that? Please, point that out. In fact, I often complain about my old neighborhood that has hundreds of Irish that come here on vacation and never go back.

I'd rather see "Jose" naturalized and pay taxes and have proper protection under the law, but that can't be done if he sneaks in here illegally.

Gadzooks! I've been called a retard on the internet? How can I ever defend myself from my witty, intellectual superior?

The difference between you and I is that you called me a racist without really understanding the word and thought it would get me to back down. I called you a retard because you keep proving yourself to be one.

Then I'm going to give the credit for any arrests to the professionals. It's not bad that these guys are nosey citizens, but likewise it's hardly commendable.

So people who help the police catch criminals are doing something wrong?

I'll admit, it is our civic duty, but you seem to be putting them down.

HUR HUR I'm going to deflect this guy's attention by mentioning two other forumers I disagree with! HUR HUR

No, I'm using other forum members who are active and vocal on these boards as examples.

Its a hell of a lot better than trying to reference Maddox. MADDOX FOR CHRIST FUKING SAKE! WHAT ARE YOU 14?

[El Blanco]

Originally Posted by KevinTheOmnivore

I need some scrilla first.

And pitchouli. Don't forget the pitchouli.

[ziggytrix]

Supervisors at the Border Patrol's Tucson sector office did not support the project, saying it disrupted operations, unnecessarily tripped sensors and had little or no impact on the flow of illegal aliens.

http://washingtontimes.com/national/...5751-9693r.htm

Gross explained that on March 23, when asked by a reporter about his view of people "hunting" migrants along the border, Bush simply said he was opposed to "vigilantes in the United States of America."

Bush later added: "I'm for enforcing the law in a rational way; that's why you have a Border Patrol and they ought to be in charge of enforcing the border."

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articl...eman-dc28.html

According to a Southern Poverty Law Center report, on April 2, the Minuteman Project "held a protest across the street from the U.S. Border Patrol headquarters in Naco, Ariz. Prominent among the demonstrators were two men who confided that they were members of the Phoenix chapter of the National Alliance . . . the largest neo-Nazi group in America. One of the two, who sat in lawn chairs throughout, held a sign with arrows depicting invading armies of people from Mexico—a sign identical to National Alliance billboards and pamphlets, except without the Alliance logo."

During the run-up to the demonstration, Shaun Walker, a National Alliance official told a reporter that they weren't "going to show up as a group and say, 'Hi, we're the National Alliance.' But we have members . . . that will participate."

"In fact," the SPLC reported, "National Alliance pamphlets were distributed in Tombstone and [Naco], this predominantly Hispanic community just two days before the Minuteman Project got going. 'Non-Whites are turning America into a Third World slum,' they read. 'They come for welfare or to take our jobs. Let's send them home now.'"

http://www.onlinejournal.com/Media/0...berkowitz.html

the whole thing is really quite hilarious

[El Blanco]

Supervisors at the Border Patrol's Tucson sector office did not support the project, saying it disrupted operations, unnecessarily tripped sensors and had little or no impact on the flow of illegal aliens.

Except for the documented increase in apprehensions followed by a decrease in sightings of illegals along that area.

Gross explained that on March 23, when asked by a reporter about his view of people "hunting" migrants along the border, Bush simply said he was opposed to "vigilantes in the United States of America."

Bush later added: "I'm for enforcing the law in a rational way; that's why you have a Border Patrol and they ought to be in charge of enforcing the border."

Oh ya, those aren't loaded statements. Who is "hunting" immigrants? Hell, I don't want that either.

I believe we've addressed the word "vigilantes".

The Border Patrol is in charge of enforcement. No one is denying that. Ordinary citizens are doing their civic duty and assisting them.

As for the racists in there: What can I say? Any large gathering is going to attract idiots and assholes.

Does that mean that all anti-war protestors were actually siding with the people there who were speaking favorably of Ossama bin Laden and Kim Jong Il?

No, it means some assholes decided it was a chance to get their message mixed in with some geniunly decent folks who were trying to do some good.

[ziggytrix]

Originally Posted by El Blanco

Except for the documented increase in apprehensions followed by a decrease in sightings of illegals along that area.

Yeah, I'm sure that had nothing to do with the 500 agent increase in Border Patrol personel that month and everything to do with civilians setting off motion detectors and disrupting Border Patrol operations.

[El Blanco]

The extra guards were for the borde rpatrol in general, not that speciffic area. And it was in direct response to the news on the MM a week before they had begun.

[ziggytrix]

OK. I guess I shouldn't listen to anything those lying Border Patrol officials say. I keep forgetting, sorry!

[Zebra 3]

Originally Posted by Ant10708

I'm studying to be an accountant so honestly the last thing I'm worried about is an illegal immigrant stealing my job.

- Right you are. You may eventually lose your job to either a legal immigrant or have the entire goddamn accounting dept. outsourced to another country.

[El Blanco]

Originally Posted by ziggytrix

OK. I guess I shouldn't listen to anything those lying Border Patrol officials say. I keep forgetting, sorry!

So, you trust government people at their word even when the evidence says otherwise?

Or is it just when it suits you?

[GAsux]

I saw a special on 48 Hours or something like that about human trafficing across the border, particularly from TJ to San Diego. It was about the sex slave trade. If you're against hot Russian chicks being smuggled into American to hump, albeit illegally, then I hate you.

I'd much rather hump hot slutty Russian chicks in the safety and security of my own city then have to go across the border to TJ and risk life and limb just to get some hot foreign sex.

Thats really all I have to say about illegal immigration.

[Zebra 3]

[ziggytrix]

Hang on - what evidence, exactly? What's your source?

As for your irrelevant, rhetorical question, I tend to distrust government officials on general principle. But what motive do they have to lie here? If these people weren't more of a nusiance than a help why are the Border Patrol officials saying otherwise?

Damn, I never figured you for the wacko conspiracy theory type!

[Emu]

They would lie about it because the Minutemen are taking their jobs.

edit: 4000 posts

[El Blanco]

The government guys are just playing CYA. Its no conspiracy its human nature. Nobody likes to hear they aren't doing an effective job.

[KevinTheOmnivore]

Originally Posted by ziggytrix

OK. I guess I shouldn't listen to anything those lying Border Patrol officials say. I keep forgetting, sorry!

Am I on crazy pills here, or is it entirely out of the question that just maybe people who would like to keep their jobs with the Border Patrol would argue that everything is going really well with the Border Patrol......?

[thebiggameover]

Originally Posted by AngPur

Have you ever been to Turkey? What the hell does location matter? Are you asking me if I know what a Mexican is? Yes, we have them in other states too, believe it or not.

if you lived here and saw just how bad shit is here, you might want to go play war in the desert too. you guys talk about jobs and taxes, im worried about my car being stolen, striped, then taken accross the border. i just think you have to be here in arizona to see just how big the problem is....

[Carnivore]

There's nothing more infuriating than having your car stolen and striped!



Illegal immigrants make up a disproportionately large segment of the prison population. Your response?

[ziggytrix]

Are you guys really suggesting that anyone thinks the existence of the Border Patrol is in danger?! If anything, I would think finding problems with the BP would lead to increases in funding, manpower, etc. assuming we aren't talking about problems of incompetancy.

They're part of Homeland Security. I REALLY don't think these guys are worried about the department being shut down because of the Minutemen.

[thebiggameover]

fuck, i cant spell...

[ziggytrix]

Originally Posted by Carnivore

Illegal immigrants make up a disproportionately large segment of the prison population. Your response?

I'd love to see a breakdown of what they were in jail for. And if INS detention facilities are counted as a segment of the prison population.

[El Blanco]

Originally Posted by ziggytrix

Are you guys really suggesting that anyone thinks the existence of the Border Patrol is in danger?! If anything, I would think finding problems with the BP would lead to increases in funding, manpower, etc. assuming we aren't talking about problems of incompetancy.

Ya, but are you going to be the guy who goes on TV and says "this job is too big for us and we need help. In fact, the guys out here in lawn chairs have really improved things around here"

I'd hate to see that poor guy's next job evaluation.

They're part of Homeland Security. I REALLY don't think these guys are worried about the department being shut down because of the Minutemen.

No, they are worried about bad press. They are a government agency.

[ziggytrix]

well then, I guess Frank Libutti better watch his ass!

http://www.washtimes.com/upi-breakin...3806-8158r.htm