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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 01:06 AM        NYC Protestors Caged in Squalor, Mistreated
The bold parts are mine.

Source: http://www.newsday.com/news/local/newyork/...itics-headlines

Anger over tactics
Protesters, lawyers decry methods used to round up demonstrators and hold them; mayor says it's not supposed to be 'Club Med'

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By GRAHAM RAYMAN, LINDSAY FABER, DAN JANISON, DARYL KHAN, STEPHANIE SAUL, KAREN FREIFELD, WIL CRUZ, SEAN GARDINER and MARSHAND BOONE

September 2, 2004

Civil liberty lawyers and protesters yesterday criticized police tactics and the use of Pier 57 to hold detainees in the aftermath of chaotic demonstrations Tuesday that resulted in nearly 1,200 arrests.

But Mayor Michael Bloomberg lauded police conduct and defended the use of the pier garage, saying, "It's not supposed to be Club Med."


So many people were taken in Tuesday that the pier filled to capacity by 8 p.m., detainees said. Officially, 1,191 people were arrested - a record for one borough in one day - for a convention total of 1,763. About half of the detainees received desk appearance tickets, court officials said.

Last night, Manhattan Criminal Court Judge John Cataldo ruled that people charged with violations had to be presented for arraignment within 24 hours or given appearance tickets. Officials had until this morning to arraign those charged with misdemeanors or felonies.

"There never have been so many people arrested ... in the history of our 80 political conventions in the United States," said Tom Hayden, the former California legislator and '60s-era activist who was a defendant in the Chicago Seven trial stemming from the 1968 Democratic convention.

Indeed, author Jules Witcover noted in a 1997 book that there were 650 arrests during the '68 convention, which included violent clashes between police and protesters on a scale not seen at this convention.

Despite the pre-convention warnings, there were no reports of major vandalism or serious injuries here Tuesday. By and large, protesters could not cite widespread instances of police using pepper spray or using their riot sticks as clubs, though there was pushing, shoving and tackling.

Donna Lieberman, director of the New York Civil Liberties Union, said police have unveiled three tactics this week that have raised concerns: quick deployment of orange netting to encircle protesters, undercover scooter patrols and widely used bicycle officers.

"The concern is the arrests are pre-emptive," she said. "You catch innocent people in those nets. Sometimes they are pulled out. But lots of people who shouldn't be getting caught up in the first place are getting snared."

"It's clear at this moment whatever civil rights were left in New York City after the Republicans came to town were violated yesterday by the police," said Eric LeCompte, who was at Ground Zero, where 200 were arrested.

Asked whether police made indiscriminate arrests, the mayor said: "I don't think there's any justification for that allegation. The Police Department is acting appropriately."

Deputy Commissioner Paul Browne, a police spokesman, said there was no "pre-emptive" arrest strategy. He noted that protest leaders had declared beforehand that they intended to perform civil disobedience and be arrested.

"When part two of civil disobedience occurs, they whine," he said. "They said they intend to engage in civil disobedience and then they cry foul."

At Ground Zero, Browne said the protest leaders agreed not to block the sidewalk. Police used bullhorns to inform marchers of the law. When they blocked the sidewalk with a banner, police stepped in.

"We arrest everybody because we have the numbers to do it," he said. "Over half of the demonstrators are from out of state, places where the police departments are too small to arrest everyone."

Meanwhile, the conditions at Pier 57 were called "appalling" during a protest yesterday.

Julia Gross, 20, of Philadelphia, who was held for nearly 30 hours, said the holding area floor was covered with chemicals that burned her skin. Worse, she said, her jailers played loud music by Irish singer Enya.

"They kept saying, 'Isn't this calming?' I never want to hear Enya again," she said.

Source: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/s...2p-195905c.html

Protesters' arresting tales

Republicans in New York

BY JONATHAN LEMIRE,
NANCY DILLON
and DAVE GOLDINER
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS

Dug Baker
Matthew Kavanagh
Many were protesters, others were in the wrong place at the wrong time. More than 1,500 have been arrested during demonstrations against the Republican National Convention. Here are some of their stories:

The party's over

Matthew Kavanagh thought there was no better way to lampoon what he called the corporate greed of the Bush administration than by holding a mock party in the middle of Wall St.

Within seconds, cops were all over Kavanagh and his friends. They wrestled protesters to the pavement and slammed their faces against the tar, even though no one was resisting, he claimed.

"How sad is that the cops need to use this sort of force against five people dancing on Wall St.?" asked Kavanagh, 25, a teacher from Boston. "They treated us like animals."

Honeymoon in lockup

Twenty-four hours in a grimy converted garage wasn't what newlyweds Hannah Taylor and Mike Owen had in mind when they came to NewYork for a week of anti-Bush demonstrations.

But that's where the couple from Wentzville, Mo., population 6,000, found themselves after they got arrested with a group of protesters.

They got stale cheese sandwiches to eat and a night on the hard floor of Pier 57, dubbed Guantanamo on the Hudson.

"They put us in cages with barbed razor wire on top," said Taylor, 18.

Innocence lost

Katherine Krassan is a middle-aged mom from suburban New Jersey, not a Bush-hating protester.

But cops swarmed around Krassan and everyone else outside Ground Zero when a demonstration got out of hand. The terrified suburbanite tried to run into a PATH station, but cops grabbed her, ignored her cries of innocence and arrested her.

She spent the next 24 hours behind bars, panicked because she couldn't reach her teenage son back home in Eastampton, N.J. "I've never been so scared in my life," said Krassan, 49. "I was just an innocent bystander. ... I never thought anything like this could ever happen to me."

Helping hand, then cuffs

Standing on a barricade to get a better look at her fellow protesters chanting at the Fox News headquarters in midtown, Lu Hampton caught the eye of a cop. He offered to help her down - then promptly put her in handcuffs.

"It was worth it to yell at Bill O'Reilly," said Hampton, 19, a student from Cleveland.

Dirty cells & nonstop Enya

Julia Gross, 20, was upset over getting arrested for protesting and even more steamed over the rash she got from lying on the motor oil-stained floor of Pier 57. But what drove her over the edge was when cops piped the New Age music of Enya into a holding cell.
"It was really degrading and upsetting," said Gross, a student from Philadelphia.

Left without his wheels

Plenty of protesters charged that cops stripped them of their dignity. Dug Baker says they took his livelihood.

The bicycle messenger was busted along with hundreds of other cyclists when they blocked traffic on W. 35th St. on Friday. He still hasn't gotten his bike back - and has nothing to do but keep on demonstrating.

"I'm glad I spoke out, but I got more than I bargained for," said Baker, 28, of Manhattan. "Without my bike, I can't work."

With Ralph R. Ortega and Helen Peterson


Source: http://www.democracynow.org/article..../09/02/1454254

(rush transcript)

AMY GOODMAN: Hundreds of people protested the conditions under which those arrested are being held before going to court, saying the site is contaminated with oil and asbestos. Pier 57, where they are being held, is a three-story block-long pier that has been converted to a holding pen.

JUAN GONZALEZ: Yesterday morning we received a call from one of the protesters being held at pier 57 who had smuggled a phone inside. Detainees passed the phone to each other and described the conditions of the holding facility. Democracy Now! producer Mike Burke took the call and spoke with the detained protesters. Listen closely. After the first caller passes the phone, you can hear a prisoner in the background calling out for help and medical assistance.

EMILY: My name is Emily. I was arrested yesterday off of Union Square East, on East 15th Street in between Union Square East and Irvine. [sic] I was on the sidewalk, and I was never told that I would be arrested. I was just on the sidewalk. And no one ever read me my rights. They just took us all away. They trapped us and put us all into buses. We’ve been in jail for over 13 hours right now. In our first nine hours, the only food we received was an apple. In our first four hours here we weren't allowed to go to the bathroom or get water. So none of us were read our rights; we haven't been able to talk to any lawyers. A lot of people here that were arrested without even protesting, they were -- just happened to be on the sidewalk where everyone was on that block -- was arrested. And there are chemical warning signs all over this place that we’re being held. A lot of people are forming rashes on their skin from the floor -- from whatever it is that is on it. And I’m going to pass this on to someone else who has another story.

VOICE SHOUTING IN THE BACKGROUND: I need medical attention!

ALTHEA: My name is Althea and I was -- am a New York City public school teacher. I was out on Union Square on 16th Street between Irving and Union Square just walking, trying to enjoy the day, and I got swept up in a demonstration. I wasn't a part of the demonstration and I was arrested. I was arrested about 8:00 p.m., handcuffed and we’ve been sitting in the Chelsea piers in very crowded conditions. Right now some people are experiencing toxic reaction to the environment, itching in their skin, and we’re very crowded. We have been given water and a sandwich, but they have not been giving us any information, and we’ve just been sitting here really penned in.

MIKE BURKE: Have you been able to communicate to any of your family or friends about your situation?

ALTHEA: No, I haven't. I have been asking my arresting officer when can I make a phone call? And no one knows where I am. Basically I feel like I’ve been ‘disappeared.’ Nobody knows in my family that I have been arrested. And I was out by myself shopping; so, you know, there's no one to -- they haven't allowed me to contact anyone.

VEEPA MAJAMUTAR: Hi. This is Veepa Majamutar. I'm calling also from the arresting facility. Basically I was just a stand-by and I was walking on the sidewalk and there was a march going on. They cordoned off the whole street and just arrested all of us. When I tried to explain that I was just walking by -- I had a receipt from a store that I had bought something from on that street. They did not pay any attention. And here we are sitting in this almost a human-rights abuse conditions. So many of us are cold. We are freezing. Some of us need medical attention; but nobody's telling us what to do. Nobody's listening to us. Nobody’s giving us any timeline, any idea of when we might get out. They’ve always been saying ‘Next two hours. Two hours.’ It's been more than 12 hours now.

MIKE BURKE: Could you describe what you were doing just before you were arrested?

VEEPA MAJAMUTAR: What was I doing?

MIKE BURKE: Yes.

VEEPA MAJAMUTAR: Basically I was just – I was walking on the sidewalk. I didn't even know that there were police and the march was going on. And all of a sudden the street basically just gets cordoned off and we cannot move. So before I was arrested I was just standing still because that's all we could really do. And then they just started putting handcuffs on people. They didn't tell us, please leave otherwise we’ll arrest you. They gave us no warning. They gave us no chance to leave. They just basically closed off the street, put handcuffs, and took us. They did not listen to anybody. They did not listen to even pure reason. They just put us off. We thought we would basically get out in a couple of hours if we had done nothing. But here we are 12 hours later and, basically, almost ridicule us. They ridicule us if we start to complain. And the condition here are atrocious. You have to see them to believe it. It's dirty. It’s smelly. It’s filthy. We don’t have a blanket. We don't have something to sit on. We are sitting on the floor. There's dirt on the floor. There’s oil on the floor. There’s chemicals around us. It's smelling bad. I could go on and on. It’s atrocious.
MIKE BURKE: Could you describe what kind of room you are in? It sounds like there are many, many people in the same room.

VEEPA MAJAMUTAR: We are like a hundred – a hundred people in a very small room. It's surrounded by fence and we are like -- it's almost like rats in a hole. I mean, there's nothing, there is just a floor which is very dirty, which is a lot of oil and all dust in it, I mean, all our clothes are dirty our hands are ditty. We had to eat an apple with our extremely dirty hands because we have no tissue paper, nothing to clean our hands with. We are just basically packed. Nobody can sit down. They don't even give us a plastic bag to sit on. They don't even give anything to lie down on. We just have to lie on the hard floor, basically. And there is not enough space for everybody to lie down because we have to sit so close together. It's cramped. And we were freezing before and people were actually coughing, they were getting cold and nobody paid any attention, nobody gave them even a blanket nobody gave them even a plastic bag to cover themselves with.

JANET: My name’s Janet and I was arrested last night. I was actually on the sidewalk. We were having a party in the street, we were dancing a little bit and then the cops started to pen us in, so we moved onto the sidewalk and there was a lot of us crammed into a small space. They did not give us an order of dispersal. Instead, they just smashed us all together; and they started -- at first they were picking people out and smashing their heads on the sidewalks. I couldn't really get a good look of that because I was in the back being like crammed between a wall and a bunch of people. Then they slowly, slowly, slowly broke us off and put us on the buses. We were on the buses for a really long time. Now we are in a holding cell. It's been probably more than 12 hours. It's been about 13 hours. They just told me when I got medical attention that there's -- they arrested 1100 people last night and we’re all still in here. It's totally nasty. The floor is greasy. There are signs everywhere saying we should be wearing masks and goggles; and I have this really bad rash on my hand that's getting worse and worse. It feels like I just stuck my hand in an oven, it burns so bad, and my arms are tingling and my other hand is getting it, too. I spent a really long time trying to let them get me out of here so I could at least wash my hands and put some ice on it. Finally my arresting officer came and she took me over there and there's a doctor and a nurse in this office and they didn't have a sink for me to wash my hands; but they let me pour saline solution over my hand into a garbage can and then rub some hand-sanitizer on my hands. My hands are so black and dirty from how gross it is in here that I couldn't even get them clean. Then they gave me a wet tissue to put on it. Basically they couldn't really do anything for me. They told me to put some hydrocortisone cream on it, which isn't very helpful because I’m in here. And now I am just sitting back in a cell with everybody else. They’re not really telling us what's going on. It seems like we’re going to be in here for a really long time.

AMY GOODMAN: Phone calls from jail. Voices of protesters detained inside pier 57. New York City mayor Michael Bloomberg has denied the city's operating what some have called Guantanamo on the Hudson, defended the use of the pier garage, saying, quote, it's not supposed to be Club Med. [partial transcript]

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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 01:26 AM       
Eh... what were they expecting to happen.

Those cops really want a full-scale riot to happen because they've got a lot of new toys they want to play with. Nobody congratulates the police for overseeing an incident-free demonstration. No kudos means no budget increases.
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 01:38 AM       
Why can't America give people a reason to like it anymore?
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 03:14 AM       
You'll always have cookie dough-flavored ice cream.
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 09:51 AM       
I'm very upset that this is being virtually ignorned by the mainstream media. This is just disgusting abuse of the 1st Amendment, in my opinion.
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 10:49 AM       
Methinks the Bush administration's randomized approach on civil rights is seeping deeper and deeper into the American society. It seems like people increasingly lower on the scale of power are feeling a-ok with applying unnecessary force when it can all be swept under the 'protecting the people' carpet.

Maybe someone needs to try the old flower-in-gun-barrel tactic again? Anyone?
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 12:13 PM       
I may sound like a doomsayer, but.... we're fucked. By the time anyone realizes we've been had, it'll be far too late for anything but a bloody revolt. Maybe not in our lifetimes, but I don't care to see how bad it gets before people regain consciousness.
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 12:45 PM       
Two things:

1.) If the arrests were indiscriminate, that will surely come out and hopefully there will be hell to pay.

2.) The use of Enya is cruel and unusual by any standard.
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 01:24 PM       
You have to admit, though, that you wonder about the mindset of someone who dances in the middle of Wall Street and then whines about being arrested. I guarantee that I could go into ANY major city and be arrested for dancing in the middle of a major thoroughfare. There isn't a special rule that goes into effect only when the President is in town.

These protesters always toe the line, just to see how far they can go and what they can get away with, only to complain when loads of people get arrested. Of course innocent people will get arrested when police see a few people in a crowd breaking the law. Why? Because those innocent bystanders aren't very helpful in pointing out the individuals who ruin it for everyone else. The only way to ensure that the perpetrators are caught is to nab everyone and sort it out later.

Protesters need to start policing themselves better before they have any right to complain about being arrested.
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 01:37 PM       
Chimp, there were more arrests than during the Chicago convention when there was violent rioting.

We have this thing called the Bill of Rights over here, you should check it out, it's one of our country's most important documents. The very first one says Americans have the right to assemble for peaceful protest. It doesn't say the cops have a right to arrest them for it.

You know how many arrests there were at the Democratic National Convention this year?
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 02:30 PM       
Barely a handful. The RNC is being held in New York, though, where there's more cops than most small cities have people. The complaints should be focusing on why there is an obvious difference in how the protests were handled, not "Boo hoo! I was arrested for standing on a barricade, even though I know barricades are meant to keep people away."

Explain how dancing in the street and blocking traffic helps your cause? You're only pissing off motorists while "sticking it to the Man."

I get to see protests a lot during the summer months. Every week there's some group standing outside the Manitoba Legislature waving signs and yelling. They're almost always people who are only there because Green Day or some other punk band said so. Sometimes they block traffic. Other times they are content to just sit on the grass. Most of the time the police don't even show up.

The most interesting ones were at the beginning of the war in Iraq. I still can't fathom how anyone would think picketing in front of a provincial government building to protest a war that Canada refused to participate in was going to do anything except annoy everyone else. But, I digress.

Police actually did oversee these demonstrations because the crowds were getting pretty rowdy. One guy, dressed in classic punk clothing, decided to show how mad he was at the U.S. by kicking over a garbage can, causing it's contents to blow all over the place. He really showed the Man, because now the Man has to pick up all that trash. The cops saw this, he saw that they saw this, so consequently he decided to run off. His friends were standing around and peacefully tried to block the police. The police decided to arrest them all (about five people altogether) and figure it all out later. I saw all of this firsthand because I was sitting on the bus waiting for another group of protesters to tire of exercising their right to hit the crosswalk button repeatedly so they could walk across while holding their little signs.

You see, there's peaceful protests, and then there's peaceful protests. I'm sure those punks were screaming bloody murder all the way to the police station, but I don't give a shit even though I agreed with the gist of what they were trying to say. Their right to protest infringed on my right to go home from university, along with the rights of all the other people who were stuck waiting in traffic. Not to mention the rights of the trash can.
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 05:58 PM       
just remember, the mayans predict the end of this stream of consciousness/world in 2011 with a major poleshift along the way. The mayans are very accurate.
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 06:38 PM       
Then our course is clearly marked. We should pursue this Mayan scourge wherever on Earth it rears it's ugly Mayan head, like we would a snake... but one with many heads... that we're not sure where it lives and might pop up anywhere. Yeah... and any state sponsors of these eeeeeeevil Mayans, too.

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How can someone who obviously thinks so much of their ideas have so little respect for expressing them? How can someone who so yearns to be taken seriously make so little effort?!
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Old Sep 3rd, 2004, 07:06 PM       
Excuse me, ENYA?!? ENYA HERE?!? Have they at last no decency? NO DECENY AT ALL?!?

I agree with aspects of both sides of the argument. The arrests were over the top, indiscriminate, and the people were held way too long, almost certainly deliberately.

But up to a point you HOPE the cops treat you badly when you do civil disobedience. Your point tets a lot more widespread attention. Civil rights protestors went knowing they'd face water cannons , dogs and truncheons. Back in the heyday of the union movements Pinkertons would beat you senseless. You did it anyway, and you didn't fight back. That's nonviolence, and the woerse your opponent behaves the better it works.

Legally fighting every aspect of your detention? Good. Take pictures of your chemical burns if you got 'em. But don't be surprised. Things are getting ugly and protests aren't picnics. If you think this is a fight now, wait until you see what it looks like if these bastards win.
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Old Sep 4th, 2004, 12:01 PM       
I think they should throw the book at any protester who breaks the law.

Good job NYPD!!!
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Old Sep 4th, 2004, 12:42 PM       
Quote:
If you think this is a fight now, wait until you see what it looks like if these bastards win.
Yeah, I've had this feeling for a while that it's going to get a lot worse before it gets better. If it ever gets better. These neo-conservatives have done such a good job of harnessing populist feelings and class rage to cultural issues rather than economic, that a long, Belfast-like civil war isn't beyond the realm of possibility.
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Old Sep 4th, 2004, 07:36 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnie Raygun
I think they should throw the book at any protester who breaks the law.

Good job NYPD!!!
Someone hasn't been paying attention.



But I wouldn't expect any less out of you, Ronnie.
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Old Sep 4th, 2004, 07:48 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnie Raygun
I think they should throw the book at any protester who breaks the law.

Good job NYPD!!!
Quote:
There are signs everywhere saying we should be wearing masks and goggles; and I have this really bad rash on my hand that's getting worse and worse. It feels like I just stuck my hand in an oven, it burns so bad, and my arms are tingling and my other hand is getting it, too.
Quote:
Basically I was just – I was walking on the sidewalk. I didn't even know that there were police and the march was going on. And all of a sudden the street basically just gets cordoned off and we cannot move. So before I was arrested I was just standing still because that's all we could really do. And then they just started putting handcuffs on people. They didn't tell us, please leave otherwise we’ll arrest you. They gave us no warning. They gave us no chance to leave.
Quote:
We’ve been in jail for over 13 hours right now. In our first nine hours, the only food we received was an apple. In our first four hours here we weren't allowed to go to the bathroom or get water. So none of us were read our rights; we haven't been able to talk to any lawyers. A lot of people here that were arrested without even protesting, they were -- just happened to be on the sidewalk where everyone was on that block -- was arrested.
Quote:
Julia Gross, 20, of Philadelphia, who was held for nearly 30 hours, said the holding area floor was covered with chemicals that burned her skin. Worse, she said, her jailers played loud music by Irish singer Enya.

"They kept saying, 'Isn't this calming?' I never want to hear Enya again," she said.
Ronnie, you douche. Did you even read the article?
Or do you think that the Bill of Rights simply doesn't apply to liberals?
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Old Sep 5th, 2004, 06:59 AM       
I think that liberals should have to abide by the same laws the rest of Americans do and should not be treated as exceptions to the rule.

I support the police.
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Old Sep 5th, 2004, 08:49 AM       
I agree with Ronnie. Normal people don't get to walk the streets, why should Liberals get special treatment?

Put them all in gaol, I say.
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Jeanette X Jeanette X is offline
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Old Sep 5th, 2004, 09:59 AM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnie Raygun
I think that liberals should have to abide by the same laws the rest of Americans do and should not be treated as exceptions to the rule.

I support the police.
The Constitution IS THE LAW. It is the supreme law of the land, and the police have violated it. To be arrested is one thing, but to not be allowed to see a lawyer is another.
I wouldn't object to the arrests if the protesters were treated like any other criminal...that is, allowed to see lawyer, and kept in a dry cell rather than a fucking cage with chemicals everywhere. Not to mention being given food and water and allowed to use the toilet. But they weren't. They weren't treated the same as anyone else. They were mistreated because they were protestors.
It is unAmerican to ignore the Constitutional rights of the protesters, even if they did break the law.
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The One and Only... The One and Only... is offline
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Old Sep 5th, 2004, 11:04 AM       
So, these stories were taken without any pictures? I'm not going to directly accuse them of lying, but when I hear about burns and rashes, I want to see some evidence.
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Old Sep 5th, 2004, 11:13 AM       
Have you been at fat camp, you fat, stupid, goink?
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The One and Only... The One and Only... is offline
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Old Sep 5th, 2004, 11:32 AM       
No, but at 162 lbs, I'm hardly fat, and a sophomore taking AP Statistics doesn't count as stupid.
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Ronnie Raygun Ronnie Raygun is offline
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Old Sep 5th, 2004, 11:56 AM       
Jeanette, is there any evidence that supports their claim?
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