Darkest Hour... ?

[Uncle Otto]

Why listen to a hardcore band trying to be a metal band, when you can listen to a metal band actually being a metal band?
Metal is not a side-dish, a flavor, something to be added to something else in small doses, etc. Either you are unashamedly, unabashedly Metal, or you aren't; you can't become metal.
To their credit, though, DH are not mere wannabes, which is more than I can say for the multitude of hardcore bands who have added a 'little' Swedish metal into their sound... fuck off, please! NWOSDM sounded good in 1995, before trendy brats discovered it and ruined it. It's been beaten into the fucking ground by now, and sounds even worse when diluted with hardcore.

Yes, 'Slaughter Of The Soul' is a great record, but we metallers knew this when it first came out, the better part of a decade ago.
Really annoying... just like when, a few years ago, many hardcore bands thought they were playing 'metal' when they added a few vaguely Slayer-ish riffs to their sound. You just don't get it...

[Grazzt]

HEAVY FUCKING METAL

[whoreable]

Guess I aint "metal" enough cause I listen to "punk" or "hardcore".
Well I guess I cant be "punk" or "hardcore" either cause I listen to "metal".

Well at least I can still be a "poser".

[Mütiilation]

so what are your credentials to be appointed such an esteemed role such as Official Sound Nazi?

One should listen to whatever suites his or her ears -- i understand what he's saying, i don't care for the copycat vibes -- but you also don't hear me telling other people they're not allowed to play it/enjoy it. Peoples opinions vary just like their tastes in music -- it happens. When you're dealing with something as subjective as personal opinion on what sounds "good", you're not going to see eye to eye with anybody, not exactly at least.

I listen to Mütiilation (obviously) -- for those of you that don't know they're a french black metal band -- now none of my friends like it, but it doesn't stop me from enjoying it. And to reverse my example -- i have a friend that listens to Forsth, and i can't stand that band to me it sounds like Gollum singing about his precious. It could curdle milk -- but i don't openly attack the fans of this music or his opinion on it because mine is different. I know my opinion doesn't mean anything and im not arrogant enough to think my opposing view could sway them from it.

I think the metal community is too hostile to its own. Like i always say, "all metal is good metal until proven other wise or grind", and yes - thats a tongue-in-cheek comment, i do enjoy some grind on occasion -- but not often.

Rodney King said it best...

[Ninjavenom]

Don't look at my playlist.

[Uncle Otto]

Credentials, Mutiilation? Do I need credentials to give my opinion?
Well, I have listened to metal for many years, so I am 'qualified', in that sense, to talk about it.
I'm actually into a bit of punk and hardcore, and also feel that the best music in these styles is 'pure'. The Cro-Mags, for one, were much better before they added metal into their equation. Don't go into the history of each genre, stating how they're all fusions of initially disparate styles, blah blah blah... I know. Each style reached a point where it was, more or less, 'pure'. That is when each genre produced its best music, don' t you think? Metal's golden age was either early 70s (Sabbath, Purple, Heep, etc.), or the early/mid-80s (Maiden, Priest, NWOBHM, et al), depending on your perspective. The genre is a fucking mess now, with all this cross-pollination of genres. It doesn't work, on the whole.
I guess what prompted my DH post was hearing one-too-many whiny faux-hardcore kid berate and ridicule metal-- and then either play in or support a band that has plagiarized the fuck out of metal music. Yes, metal is easy to poke fun at and stereotype- but isn't HC? In almost ALL of the bands, almost all of the players have short hair, dress the same, whine about social issues that some nerd with a guitar is never going change, etc. Same formula as metal, only the examples are different. I could go on here, but you know the story.

[BulletCatcher]

I rarely ever hear hc kids openly bash metal. I do, however, see metalheads bash hc.

Also, not everyone shares your opinion on genre cross-breeding. I think all this cross pollenation is actually good and brings with it a fresh breath of air to stale music scenes, and amazing bands like Between the Buried and Me and Dillinger Escape Plan, who thrive on combining styles.

If it wasn't for genre cross-breeding we wouldn't even have rock n roll.

[Mütiilation]

i agree with what you said, bullet catcher, though i dislike your examples.

those bands you named, they aren't exactly... well they're not being let on metal-archives because its been established that they're not metal. I figued i'd use a backing for my opinion because im not one to bash on things just because i don't like them heh though thats exactly what i'm doing now i guess. I still don't think dillenger comes from metal, its more of a technical/prog/hardcore weaving.

Just think about how metal came about though, i mean we've got rock 'n roll to start us off yeilding to glam and thrash, thrash went into death metal and glam went into power metal and thankfully glams gone hah, and death metal turned into black metal (an example of this slow change could be seen through the works of darkthrone -- soulside journey was death metal, and say... Mayhem, the album deathcrush was death metal influenced) and black metal brought on Viking Metal and what not.

To recap, cross breeding is how genres become established - i think its healthy and "43% burnt" was the only dillenger escape plan song i could ever even half-like

[Helm]

glam had very little to do with power metal. Power metal was a more teutonic version of good ol' heavy.


Anyway, I don't give a fuck about purism of any kind, just a small clarification.

[The Chief]

I rarely ever hear hc kids openly bash metal. I do, however, see metalheads bash hc

That's because they aren't really metalheads but poseurs.

Incidentally, during the 1980s, all I used to hear was hardcore punk fans bashing metal...

[The One and Only...]

Metal never died in 80's, The Cheif. Heavy Metal, maybe, but Heavy Metal was never the best. I'll take my Death Metal any day.

Oh yeah... Hardcore + Metal = good music in many cases, such as Grindcore.

[The Chief]

It's either "heavy metal" or it isn't. JMHO. Whatever "heavy metal" may be. Sounds like a term from chemistry class.

I'm not fond of nomenclature either. One of my fav bands being Motorhead (classic lineup that is, Lemmy/Eddie/Philthy), how can they ever be classified? Rock & Roll I'd call them, but nothing I've heard lately comes close.

Gotta love "grindcore", boy do the PR guys love making up new names. How about "puke metal", "vomitcore", "diarrhea metal", what's next I wonder...?