Pentegarn, fair enough, I can agree with what you're saying (however Kahljorn's "reply" leaves a bit to wish for), even though I think you may be splitting hairs a bit. It sounds a bit like when communists defend communism in the similar fashion ("what we've seen haven't been true communisms").
For most people, economists included, value-for-value trading isn't some sort of mandatory ingredient of a financial capitalism. However, the complex system of financial intermediaries that toy with money that isn't theirs is sort of a cornerstone.
Let's at least agree that the whole process of spending money that doesn't exist is symptomatic of a capitalism. It's also precisely what's caused the recent crisis.
Pentegarn, fair enough, I can agree with what you're saying (however Kahljorn's "reply" leaves a bit to wish for), even though I think you may be splitting hairs a bit. It sounds a bit like when communists defend communism in the similar fashion ("what we've seen haven't been true communisms").
That's just it though, while communists can say that, they have no era where communism works effectively to use as a basis of comparison, while capitalism does. Yes, the stock market, speculation, and futures may be a side effect of free trade, (though I tend to call them a cancer, as I prefer investors be people shaking hands with other people as opposed to what we have in the stock market now) but they weren't always there, and when they weren't the economy was only effected by tangible occurrences like war and shortages. That is my point when I say "true capitalism" versus this mockery of capitalism we try to pass off as free trade and value for value nowadays.
TheCoolinator 
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