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Dimnos Dimnos is offline
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Old Feb 16th, 2010, 04:16 PM        The reason Airlines are failing...
...pilots are making less money than janitors, your meals are total shit and you have to pay extra just to check a bag. Is because tiny ass do nothing parts that have absolutly nothing to do with the air worthieness of the plane cost a god damn arm and a leg just for the paperwork that says they are what they are. This...



Is a plastic cap. It goes on the end of a fire pull handle to protect it DURING SHIPPING! It doesnt even go on the plane itself. Here it is next to a penny and a pen cap so you can see exactly how big and complex this piece is.



Take a wild guess how much this important piece of machinery electronics flimsy plastic cost. Go on take a guess.

Spoilers!


Im not really sure who I should be frustrated with. The bureaucrats that make the regulations, the airlines who decided to take one step further, everyone else in the industry who just goes along with it or the consumers at the end of the money line who continue to pay out money to cover this kind of BS.
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Dr. Boogie Dr. Boogie is offline
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Old Feb 16th, 2010, 04:45 PM       
I'm confused. You have to order safety caps like that individually at a huge markup?
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Dimnos Dimnos is offline
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Old Feb 16th, 2010, 05:55 PM       
Normally no. Most of the time with these units the handle itself is damaged and the replacement part is shipped to us with one already on it. Sometimes the handle isnt broken and our customer ships it to us with a cap on it. However in a few cases we get a good one that is missing it and we apparently have to replace it because its a part that is actually listed in the manual. Bla bla bla...

My overall point is that because of all the damn trace paperwork required for every little pice of crap, prices are insanely high for what your getting. Your more paying for a paper shuffle than the part itself. This is how a flimsy ass $0.05 pieces of plastic, regardless of how flight critical it is, becomes a $50 part. I have every day screws that anyone could pick up at any hardware store for $0.01 each that cost $5 $10 or even $30 a pop just because they come with this magic paperwork that makes it "OK" to go on a plane.
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Evil Robot Evil Robot is offline
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Old Feb 16th, 2010, 11:35 PM       
But if the parts didn't come with a certificate of origin we would wind up with untraceable shit parts from god knows where china and there would be no liability insurance when planes crash leading to billions of dollars worth of lawsuits.
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Fathom Zero Fathom Zero is offline
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Old Feb 16th, 2010, 11:41 PM       
I don't think outrageous markups are exclusive to the airline industry, even though your experience is insane.

I've seen crazy things in the golf scene.
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 01:43 AM       
kevin smith's fat ass?
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Wiffles Wiffles is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 05:18 AM       
Maybe the airline should make a more comprehensive small-parts inventory rather than ordering parts individually with a huge markup. Only ordering big parts for big jobs, which really matter. Small parts inventory on all major repair hangars for every make of plane in the fleet, with paperwork already done. After all how big can they get, normally its buttons, knobs, fuses, that need replacing regularly.
But in the long run, prople really need to travel, so I guess they'll have to put up with it ^.^;
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Dimnos Dimnos is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 11:26 AM       
Imagine if Fathom there decided he was going to start making planes. He decides to make the F0-10. Also imagine Evil Robot thought it would be kick ass if there was and Evil Robot airlines so he buys a few F0-10s from Fathom. Years later Fathom decides to close up shop for whatever reason. He is no longer manufacturing parts for the F0-10. The good Dr Boogie knows there is still a market for the parts because he knows Evil Robot wants to continue flying his planes. So Boogie figures out haw to manufacture the parts to the exact standards that Fathom used to make them. Boogie contacts the FAA and tells them how he is doing it and they come check out his operation and decided he is doing a fine job at it as issues him a Parts Manufacturer Approval (PMA). The FAA also tells Evil Robot that every part on his plane has to be tested and recertified every year to make sure its still good and in working condition because they dont want anything going wrong and planes falling out of the sky. So Evil Robot sends me a part and tells me to test it. I test it and find out that it has some corroded nuts that need to be replaced. I contact Boogie who tells me he has them and will sell them to me for $20. Awesome! This works and this is what has been going on for years.

However here recently Evil Robot has decided he doesnt want nuts from anyone but Fathom. Despite the fact that Boogies nuts have been perfectly acceptable for years. So next time Evil Robot sends me parts...

I tell Evil Robot I want to use Boogies nuts but he isnt so sure he wants Boogies nuts. He only wants Fathoms nuts. So I do a little more looking around and find that Wiffles has some of Fathoms nuts she got back when he was still manufacturing them. She ended up not needing them so they have just been sitting on a shelf all this time. However she knows Evil Robot only wants Fathoms nuts and that we will be hard pressed to find them anywhere else so she will only sell them to me for $700.

Now Boogies nuts are not only cheaper they are newer as well. Meanwhile Fathoms nuts that Wiffles are not only drastically more expensive they have also been sitting around collecting dust. Both the FAA and I say that Boogies nuts are perfectly fine but thats not good enough for Evil Robot. He has the crazy idea that for them to be worth a damn at all they have to come from Fathom.
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Fathom Zero Fathom Zero is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 11:46 AM       
I got the nuts everyone wants.
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Wiffles Wiffles is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 11:54 AM       
Thats pretty intense, thanks for the example. But if the airlines want to buy OEM parts at exorbitant prices. What is stopping them from buying the cheaper tested-and-approved, third party parts?
Corruption? Failure to update their list of prefered manufacturers? and Corporate favoritism? Or is there other variables that come into play that determines why things work the way they do?
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Dimnos Dimnos is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 12:12 PM       
I personally think its something along the lines of

"Well the FAA requires us to meet these standards. Why dont we take it a few steps further just so we can say we go above and beyond that."

While the idea is noble and what not I think they take it a bit too far. People dont go around paying ambulances to follow them around just to be extra safe.
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 12:15 PM       
I can understand buying original parts if I'm selling a plane, but not if I'm flying it.
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Wiffles Wiffles is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 12:32 PM       
Oh, so its basically a lack of confidence towards third party manufacturers all in the name of safety, but with minimal or no gains at all. Expense Gets passed to the consumer and reduced pay for the aircrew.

So basically all the money in the air business goes to parts suppliers who profit from hoarding discontinued parts and sustained by lack of trust and support for third party makers, on the airlines part.
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Tadao Tadao is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 12:44 PM       
From the point of view of the parts department, probably.
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Dimnos Dimnos is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 01:13 PM       
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiffles View Post
So basically all the money in the air business goes to parts suppliers who profit from hoarding discontinued parts and sustained by lack of trust and support for third party makers, on the airlines part.
Not all of it but a lot of it.

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From the point of view of the parts department, probably.
This.
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Evil Robot Evil Robot is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 09:42 PM       
Is anybody else getting the banner ads for Boeing?
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 10:53 PM       
cheap flights to germany.
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 10:56 PM       
i don't get banner ads
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Evil Robot Evil Robot is offline
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Old Feb 17th, 2010, 11:32 PM       
Boeing wants me to know about their tanker planes.
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