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Tadao Tadao is offline
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 05:16 PM        Global Warming
So, what I understand global warming to be in it's most basic form is that the ocean is warming ever so slightly, but enough to change currents.

This has an impact on weather, glaciers, and coastal levels.

Is that wrong?
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 06:48 PM       
Didn't the earth used to have no atmosphere and was like thousands of degrees? Whatever happened to that?
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 07:03 PM       
I believe it grew an atmosphere and cooled off. That would explain trying to protect the atmosphere. Much in the same way that polluting mars would warm it up so that we can live there.
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 09:44 PM       
Tad is right - the temperature of the ocean is the driving force for most of the planet's weather. As an example, an oceanic thermal inversion a.k.a. el Nino gives rise to weird weather patterns in the Americas. That's only a relatively small warm water patch across the South Pacific - imagine it over the entire hydrologic surface of the globe.
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 10:34 PM       
There's an ongoing debate weather this is a cyclical phenomena or human induced. Some say it may even do a reverse, and cool-off the world into an ice age.
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 10:41 PM       
For that to happen, well I don't know. Some one tell me how the ocean rising in temperature is going to create another iceage in the near future please.
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 10:48 PM       
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Originally Posted by Wiffles View Post
There's an ongoing debate weather this is a cyclical phenomena or human induced. Some say it may even do a reverse, and cool-off the world into an ice age.
Yeah, they say it warms up a ton before it plunges into an ice age.
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 10:58 PM       
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For that to happen, well I don't know. Some one tell me how the ocean rising in temperature is going to create another iceage in the near future please.
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Yeah, they say it warms up a ton before it plunges into an ice age.

According to some scientists, the supposed ice age will start once the ocean's salinity reaches a certain level. With the oceans warming, and ice caps melting. The salinity levels of the ocean drops, this alters our oceans dramatically, and changes the cyclical currents already at play. Creating new weather patterns and ultimately, another ice age.

Timescales are still big, from hundreds to thousands of years. But geologically speaking, rapid.
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 11:42 PM       
I don't understand yet why less salt in the ocean equals ice age yet. You didn't actually say why. Why?
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Old Mar 9th, 2010, 11:45 PM       
Salinity affects the movement of water molecules, i.e. heat, I RECALL LEARNING IN THE 7TH GRADE.
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 01:59 AM       
Yeah, in 7th grade it was 1982 for me. I was busy was kinda busy at the time.
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 02:40 AM       
I'm more worried about rising ocean levels. Well, not in such that I am going to drown in the next few years (I do live on an island, next to the ocean though) but that it's going to displace a lot of people one day.
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 03:02 AM       
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Originally Posted by Evil Robot View Post
Didn't the earth used to have no atmosphere and was like thousands of degrees? Whatever happened to that?
i miss those days too
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 10:47 AM       
Christ, I started writing an essay here on why environmentalists are insane and why climate deniers are stupid, but shit hasn't this stuff been covered here yet? Yes, the earth does warm and cool in cycles, thats not what is alarming, its the fact that it is deviating from what the natural cycle should be.

But the next ice age is scheduled in 16000 years, so we don't have to worry much about that. And that is a current estimate, including the recent unexpected heat increase. (in the 80s it was an estimate 19000)
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 12:50 PM       
As I think I said in "that other thread" there is still a lot we don't really understand about how and why the global climate cycles. Devotees of the ALGOR robot seem to point to the industrial revolution as the beginning of a gradual global warming, and claim this to be evidence of the human influenced warming trend which is outside of what we can infer from ice cores and tree rings as "normal" cyclic variation.

Then you have the FOXY contingent who points to a period in time known as "the Medieval Warming Period" where the average temperature increased even though there was no significant contribution from manmade activity.

So they argue. And argue. It's like a bad SNL sketch. "You shut up!" "No, you shut up!" (repeat ad.lib.) It's actually funny when you see it happen in a scientific forum like the ACS. And sad at the same time.

We'll likely not know the full story, or understand the implications of our actions today until after whatever is in store for us is already in full swing. And by then, it will be too late.

I believe it's called "fiddling while Rome burns".
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 03:07 PM       
The co-founder of Green Peace said it the best.....

"The environmentalist movement has been hijacked and turned into something completely different then what it should have been"

Watch the Great Global Warming swindle free on google video

The first thing my environmentalist professor taught us was to NOT be anthropocentric. Meaning to not believe that the world revolves around humans because it does not. We have very little bearing on what happens to the earth in the grand scheme of things. Do we really have the ability to change the climate? I say No but that doesn't mean we don't have the ability to literally make a complete mess of things.



As long as they keep the greenie's focused on the global warming plan and keep that money coming in for all the so called climate scientists then big industry will continue to destroy and pillage until there is nothing left. CO2 as a pollutant is a red herring!
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 03:34 PM       
How naive.
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 04:04 PM       
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In green houses all over the world they pump in CO2 to accelerate the growth of plants.
I bet people are having a volley ball tournament inside the CONTAINED green house while they are pumping in Co2.
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 04:15 PM       
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The first thing my environmentalist professor taught us was to NOT be anthropocentric. Meaning to not believe that the world revolves around humans because it does not. We have very little bearing on what happens to the earth in the grand scheme of things. Do we really have the ability to change the climate? I say No but that doesn't mean we don't have the ability to literally make a complete mess of things.
But in Om Sannolikheten För Sekulära Förändringar I Atmosfärens Kolsyrehalt, Högbom explained how he had calculated that industry was putting as much CO2 into the atmosphere as there would have been produced naturally. You don't think that could do something?
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 04:19 PM       
All we have to do is live in green houses!
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 04:31 PM       
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In green houses all over the world they pump in CO2 to accelerate the growth of plants.
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CO2 as a pollutant is a red herring!
Wait, wait, wait, do you think that people are saying that CO2 is a pollutant? You know what plants breath, right?

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I attack the global warming myth from the left not from the right and it crumbles every time.
How does it crumble? All you have ever posted about it is that it is a lie being perpetuated by scientists and big business. You have never posted any studies or actual information that would show the theory to be incorrect/impossible. The closest you came was when you posted that link to a clearly biased "documentary."
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 04:32 PM       
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You don't think that could do something?
No, because CO2 is not a pollutant.

If industry just pumped out CO2 and water vapor I would be very pleased. The problem comes in when they start pumping out other stuff. Hence why industrial sectors have to be inspected regularly that their emissions don't contain real harmful chemicals. Scrubbers on smoke stacks do not absorb CO2 because it's an irrelevant gas. They focus mainly of the poisonous particulate from the creation of the energy.


Here is another way to think of it. All living organisms exhale CO2. There are 6 billion people around the world exhaling CO2 at one time plus the rest of the animal kingdom. You would think that much CO2 gas would have killed us the minute the human race got up to 5 billion.
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 04:35 PM       
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No, because CO2 is not a pollutant.

If industry just pumped out CO2 and water vapor I would be very pleased. The problem comes in when they start pumping out other harmful chemicals. Hence why industrial sectors have to be inspected regularly that their emissions don't contain real harmful chemicals. Scrubbers on smoke stacks do not absorb CO2 because it's an irrelevant gas. They focus mainly of the poisonous particulate from the creation of the energy.


Here is another way to think of it. All living organisms exhale CO2. There are 6 billion people around the world exhaling CO2 at one time plus the rest of the animal kingdom. You would think that much CO2 gas would have killed us the minute the human race got up to 5 billion.
I'm quoting this to preserve it.
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Old Mar 10th, 2010, 04:38 PM       
Red Herring...
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The expression red herring is an idiom referring to a device which intends to divert the audience from the truth or an item of significance. For example, in mystery fiction, an innocent party may be purposefully cast as highly suspect through emphasis or descriptive techniques; attention is drawn away from the true guilty party.
Im pretty sure he is saying it is not a pollutant. However I too wish to know how it "crumbles" because you attack it "from the left".
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